The final round
Dr Shabir Choudhry 29 January 2009
India and Pakistan had a full scale war in September 1965. Air Marshal ® Asghar Khan in his book called it ‘The first round’; even though both countries had a military clash in Ran of Kachh in the same year. Apart from that both countries fought each other in a protracted war over Kashmir in 1947 which ended on 1st January 1949. Many say the war never ended, as it is continuing in different form and shape till today.
History is a funny subject. We try to understand historical events through eyes of others. If four people witness an event and they all go away and explain that event we will end up having four different versions of the same event, and those listening to these events could either misunderstand, forget or overlook some aspects of the event, hence different versions of the same event. Furthermore experience, knowledge and perspective help us to formulate our views and our ideologies.
If some one completes his doctorate in Maths or Science, very few if any will question his/her knowledge or challenge his formulae like people do in Social Siences; but if some one spends same number of years in studies and completes doctorate in History or Politics, two disciplines of Social Sciences, he/she will have many challengers and critics. Even a person who reads newspaper for a few months feels confident to assert his/her claim to be an expert on history and politics.
In most Pakistani history books it is claimed that it was India who ‘cowardly attacked’ Pakistan on 6th September 1965, and Pakistan emerged ‘victorious’ in this military confrontation. Some Pakistani history books even claim that Pakistan was not defeated in the war of 1971. To them it was the Bengalis who could not maintain their independence, as if they were a separate and independent country at that time. These ‘historians’ and ‘experts’ also claim that Pakistan won a major victory in 1999 during the Kargil war.
Fact regarding the 1965 war is that it was Pakistan which initiated the war by sending thousands of guerrillas under the plan called ‘Operation Gibraltar’ in Jammu and Kashmir to engage and disrupt the Indian army supply lines, and also by invading parts of areas of Jammu and Kashmir under India. Pakistani and Azad Kashmiri forces under the command of Lt General Akhtar Hussain Malik invaded areas of Chamb - Jorian and were advancing towards Akhnoor, and fall of this important town also looked imminent. At that crucial time Pakistani military and political elite decided to hand over the command to Lt General Yayya Khan, as they didn’t want the credit to go to a Qadiyani General, Akhtar Hussain Malik.
Anticipating an imminent fall of Akhnoor and victory stretching as far as Jammu to cut off the supply line of the Indian forces, Pakistani government declared that their forces were advancing towards Akhnoor. Yayya Khan had his own ‘interests’ and reached 24 hour late to take over the command, which gave enough time to India to bolster its defences. After Pakistan’s acknowledgement the Indian government announced that they will open a new front of their choice.
Pakistani government was under this false illusion created by the Foreign Minister of the time that India will never cross the International Border. When under pressure in Jammu and Kashmir India attacked Lahore and Sialkot with full force on 6th September 1965. Both countries claimed victory in 1965 war.
Indira Gandhi, Prime Minister of India, was asked that Pakistan claims to have won the war, what do you say to this. She replied: Pakistan started this war to get Jammu and Kashmir. If after the war these areas are under Pakistan then they have won, and if they are still with us then we have won.
That apart India and Pakistan have not yet matured enough that they could live side by side in peace and harmony with each other. Both countries have strong influence of extremists, who at times call shots and force governments to move in certain directions. Pakistani extremists say they will destroy India and reduce it to the size of Sri Lanka. The Indian extremists say they will break Pakistan in to 40 pieces; and that they made a mistake in 1971 and should have finished the rest of Pakistan at that time.
After the defeat and surrender in East Pakistan the Pakistan army and the ruling elite were in a state of shock, so it is difficult to say what could have happened if India had continued with the war on the Western front. Some sections of the Indian government and the army wanted to continue the war and finish the ‘job’, but it is learnt that the USA categorically told the Indians to call it a day and not to continue the war in West Pakistan.
The situation now has changed. Pakistan is smaller in size, but it is a country with nuclear weapons, and this has changed the whole scenario. Despite this ‘strength’ or plus point, Pakistan has many minus points. The country is more divided than it was in 1971, and many Pakistanis don’t envisage a bright future. Economically it is ruined and there is militancy going on in FATA, Swat and other parts of the Frontier province where the government has practically lost its writ. Apart from that for the first time in its history there is a serious danger to Pakistan from its Western border.
India is a big country with strong economy and ample resources. It is emerging regional economic and military power, and envisages an international role for itself; and international players are willing to assign certain roles to India. Pakistan in that sense is not in the same league; but in view of some analysts it has ability and plans to hold back progress of India by bleeding India and engaging it in some kind of protracted military conflict. These analysts give example of different insurgencies going on in India and one in Jammu and Kashmir; and moreover terrorist actions like that of Mumbai.
Anger, resentment or hatred is one thing, but the Indian public opinion is divided as they are not sure what to do with Pakistan. Some still suggest the dialogue and peace process even though it did not bring tangible results and crumbled under the rubbles of Mumbai attacks. This group is of the opinion that India has made tremendous progress and a military confrontation, even a conventional one will be disastrous; and it will be walking into the trap of Pakistan and extremists.
Others say enough is enough; India has to teach Pakistan a lesson, and speak in a language which Pakistan understands. This group thinks if India continues to acquiesce and swallow every bitter pill which comes its way from Pakistan then it will seriously harm India’s image and future regional and strategic plans. This group is of the opinion that now is the time to strike at Pakistan and cut it to size that it is not a threat to India in future.
But the question is what to do with the nuclear capability of Pakistan. Pakistanis say India is not America and Pakistan is not Iraq or Afghanistan; and that they are capable to deal with any Indian adventurism. Hawks in the Indian political and military elite and the extremists say we have no choice but to have this final round with Pakistan to settle matters for once and all. In their view this stalemate could not continue; and that they would not be kept hostage to this nuclear threat and would not tolerate Pakistan’s ‘terrorism’ and ‘proxy wars’.
It is claimed by some experts that India, America and Israel have worked some contingency plan to deal with nuclear aspect of the problem. Even a child in a street knows that in a war situation when pushed against the wall Pakistan would use its trump card – nuclear weapons, this means India, Israel and America also know it very well. Some Indian experts advocate a strategy to take out Pakistani nukes and control and command system. They believe Israeli and the American help and technical support should be available to complete the task.
Purpose of the new war will be to establish two or at least one new country in that region. One could be an independent Balochistan by taking some parts of Iran, Afghanistan and Pakistani Balochistan; and the second by taking some parts of FATA, parts of Frontier province and parts of Afghanistan, which could help them to control matters there.
One clear objective of this could be to ensure that there are no direct land links between Pakistan and China and Pakistan and Iran. Furthermore India, a strategic partner of America, should have direct access to Afghanistan and Central Asian countries without going through Pakistan. Also they don’t want India to have access to Iran through Pakistan, so for this purpose a road is already being built by India from Afghanistan to Iranian port of Chabahar. All this could only happen by making some geographical changes in the region.
If and when this final round starts the main war theatre will be areas adjacent to Afghanistan. India’s main target will be areas of AJK and Gilgit and Baltistan. In my article, ‘The coming of a new war’, I wrote in November 2008 as follows: ‘I urge people in power to exercise restraint, and make a new start by setting up some kind of mechanism to fight monster of terrorism. If however a military clash has to take place, I think it could take place by February and March of 2009 with disastrous consequences.’
However I hope that common sense prevails and both countries show maturity, and learn to live as good neighbours without going through the experience of another war.
Writer is a Spokesman of Kashmir National Party, political analyst and author of many books and booklets. Also he is Director Institute of Kashmir Affairs. Email:drshabirchoudhry@gmail.com
To view other articles see my blog: www.drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com
My blog provides alternative view on Kashmir dispute and politics of South Asia, especially India Pakistan relations. It aims to educate people that they can make informed judgements.
Wednesday, 28 January 2009
Wednesday, 14 January 2009
A reply to Rohit Kaul
Dear Rohit Kaul Sahib adab
Thank you for your email and comments.
You wrote:
‘I want to ask Dr. Shabir one question. He left JKLF Yasin group in 2004. All Kashmiri Pandits had left the Valley by then. A large number were killed in the Valley. It was jklf gun. Hizb came in very late.’
Reply
Rohit Sahib you have to understand the situation of that time. At that time there was no mass communication and no access to information. Today as a result of advancement in information technology things are known instantly by email, text message, youtube or TV news bulletins.
These facilities were not available at that time. Our source of information was Amanullah Khan who was Chair at that time. We sincerely believed everything what our Chair of the time told us, but we didn’t know that his source of information were hawaldaars and inspectors of ISI. So we were not aware of the true situation as we were based in England.
As a result of Amanullah Khan’s wrong policies and unconstitutional measures we challenged him in 1992/93, and were left with no option but to establish our own JKLF. We established our own contacts and came to know about wrong doings of some JKLF militants. After 1994 we have time and again condemned those wrongs and wrote in support of Kashmiri Pandits and demanded their return to their homes with respect and dignity.
I can show you many statements and articles written in mid 1990s onwards, but ‘fake men’ on Kashnet will get activated and say that I am ‘seeking publicity’. It was at that time the Pakistani agencies and their agents started making allegations against me.
In fact in some of the JKLF meetings in England I was accused of being ‘too pro Pundits’ and easily influenced by the Indian propaganda.
Just for records sake we parted with Yasin Malik in 2001 and not in 2004.
You wrote:
‘If ISI support for jklf of militancy was ok, what kind of nationalist the Doctor is? He has turned a secular overnight. It is hard to believe. Leopard can't change his spots.’
Reply
I have not turned secular over night. I have a track record of promoting secular and liberal politics. My first book on history and politics of Kashmir (Kashmir Ki Quomi Azadi and Pakistan) was published in 1989, in which I have promoted liberal and democratic politics. In all my books, booklets and articles I have spoken against extremism and advanced liberal and secular politics.
The fact that due to lack of information I could not write against the plight of the Pandits at that particular time doesn’t make me a less secular. Also the fact that if some people have not read any of my books doesn’t make me a ‘fanatic’ or non secular. It is not writer’s responsibility to make sure that everyone reads his books. Some times you can give a book to some one but you can’t make him read or understand what you want him to understand. There is old saying, you can buy a bed but not sleep.
You wrote
It makes 14 years from 1990 to 2004. jklf was paid by ISI for militancy and politics. Shabir Choudhry was JKLF diplomatic spokesperson. Who was looking after his kitchen for 14 years. Who was looking after the kitchen of JKLF people in Islamabad?
Reply
I am living in England since 1966, and even worked during my university days. In England you don’t need support of ISI or any other agency to look after your kitchen. If people don’t work still they are paid enough to live comfortably, especially if you have children and a loan on house, as you get Housing Benefit as well.
So I can assure you that I looked after my own kitchen. And if it is not taken as a show off, I can tell you that many kitchens in AJK and Pakistan are looked after by regular donations given by me.
As for the Kitchens of those JKLF people who were in AJK and in Pakistan are concerned, I suppose the local JKLF people looked after their own kitchens, and those who came from the other side they were looked after by those who invited them and trained them.
You wrote
He has played a role in the crime against Pandits and many Muslims. JKLF forced people to put advertrisements in local press announcing their dissociation from NC, Congress, PDP and Communist Party.
Reply
No Rohit Sahib, I have no role in any crime, either against Pandits or Muslims. If you are a member of the Congress or a BJP and some members of these parties go and kill innocent Muslims in Gujrat or some Christians else where does it mean you are also a criminal just because you are in the same party?
Thank you for your email and comments.
You wrote:
‘I want to ask Dr. Shabir one question. He left JKLF Yasin group in 2004. All Kashmiri Pandits had left the Valley by then. A large number were killed in the Valley. It was jklf gun. Hizb came in very late.’
Reply
Rohit Sahib you have to understand the situation of that time. At that time there was no mass communication and no access to information. Today as a result of advancement in information technology things are known instantly by email, text message, youtube or TV news bulletins.
These facilities were not available at that time. Our source of information was Amanullah Khan who was Chair at that time. We sincerely believed everything what our Chair of the time told us, but we didn’t know that his source of information were hawaldaars and inspectors of ISI. So we were not aware of the true situation as we were based in England.
As a result of Amanullah Khan’s wrong policies and unconstitutional measures we challenged him in 1992/93, and were left with no option but to establish our own JKLF. We established our own contacts and came to know about wrong doings of some JKLF militants. After 1994 we have time and again condemned those wrongs and wrote in support of Kashmiri Pandits and demanded their return to their homes with respect and dignity.
I can show you many statements and articles written in mid 1990s onwards, but ‘fake men’ on Kashnet will get activated and say that I am ‘seeking publicity’. It was at that time the Pakistani agencies and their agents started making allegations against me.
In fact in some of the JKLF meetings in England I was accused of being ‘too pro Pundits’ and easily influenced by the Indian propaganda.
Just for records sake we parted with Yasin Malik in 2001 and not in 2004.
You wrote:
‘If ISI support for jklf of militancy was ok, what kind of nationalist the Doctor is? He has turned a secular overnight. It is hard to believe. Leopard can't change his spots.’
Reply
I have not turned secular over night. I have a track record of promoting secular and liberal politics. My first book on history and politics of Kashmir (Kashmir Ki Quomi Azadi and Pakistan) was published in 1989, in which I have promoted liberal and democratic politics. In all my books, booklets and articles I have spoken against extremism and advanced liberal and secular politics.
The fact that due to lack of information I could not write against the plight of the Pandits at that particular time doesn’t make me a less secular. Also the fact that if some people have not read any of my books doesn’t make me a ‘fanatic’ or non secular. It is not writer’s responsibility to make sure that everyone reads his books. Some times you can give a book to some one but you can’t make him read or understand what you want him to understand. There is old saying, you can buy a bed but not sleep.
You wrote
It makes 14 years from 1990 to 2004. jklf was paid by ISI for militancy and politics. Shabir Choudhry was JKLF diplomatic spokesperson. Who was looking after his kitchen for 14 years. Who was looking after the kitchen of JKLF people in Islamabad?
Reply
I am living in England since 1966, and even worked during my university days. In England you don’t need support of ISI or any other agency to look after your kitchen. If people don’t work still they are paid enough to live comfortably, especially if you have children and a loan on house, as you get Housing Benefit as well.
So I can assure you that I looked after my own kitchen. And if it is not taken as a show off, I can tell you that many kitchens in AJK and Pakistan are looked after by regular donations given by me.
As for the Kitchens of those JKLF people who were in AJK and in Pakistan are concerned, I suppose the local JKLF people looked after their own kitchens, and those who came from the other side they were looked after by those who invited them and trained them.
You wrote
He has played a role in the crime against Pandits and many Muslims. JKLF forced people to put advertrisements in local press announcing their dissociation from NC, Congress, PDP and Communist Party.
Reply
No Rohit Sahib, I have no role in any crime, either against Pandits or Muslims. If you are a member of the Congress or a BJP and some members of these parties go and kill innocent Muslims in Gujrat or some Christians else where does it mean you are also a criminal just because you are in the same party?
Tuesday, 13 January 2009
A reply to a Fake Man
Dear Kashnet readers aslamo alaykam and adab.
Some of you might have followed the debate which started as a result of my article ‘Why Indians are influential’? After explaining some of the achievements of the Indians abroad I emphasised that we Kashmiris abroad should stop giving receptions and parties to patwaris, inspectors and politicians who visit from back home; and use our resources to educate our children that they could become more competitive.
Some people get electrified when you associate anything good with India. They want India and Pakistan in a state of war all the time, as it suites their agenda. Others didn’t want Kashmiris from Azad Kashmir to be empowered by getting educated, as my message was to discard bad traditions and invest in future of their children. This group, which represents imperial powers and knows very well that it is easy to control and manipulate uneducated lot; and moreover they don’t their receptions and other perks to stop.
I said in one post that some people will criticise me no matter what I do, and even if I pray they will say folding of my hands was not correct. There are three reasons for this opposition: Personal dislike and personal matters, ideological differences and it brings bread and butter to the house.
If by criticising me it helps them to run their kitchen I don’t mind what they are saying about me.
I welcome criticism as long if it is not indecent. Also I respect all as long as they use their own names to express their opinion or criticise. Siraj Sahib criticised me – he was sincere in his criticism and even though he used some harsh words and I disagreed with him, I called him brother and respected his opinion. In return he realised his mistake, and as a decent man he apologised for his harsh words; and his image in my opinion and in opinion of others has enhanced ten fold.
Chankia Jee
What I dislike is people using fake Kashnet id’s to attack genuine people involved in the struggle. Chankia Jee, who is master of lies, deceit and back stabbing, has used many fake Id’s in the past to attack me and set me up for a fight with others. He is doing it again. I though he might change, but I was wrong, nature DOES NOT change. If Chankia Jee uses his own ID and ask me questions I will reply him appropriately.
In the past Chankia jee, by using fake ID, made some allegations against me and made it appear as if Barrister Majid Tramboo was doing it. He thought I would take the bait. I did not take, and simply replied that all allegations were unfounded and baseless.
Barrister Majid Tramboo and I worked as a team in the JKLF and worked very effectively. After differences he had his way and I had mine. I was angry as I thought he let me down (of course he has his own opinion on the matter), and wrote some articles explaining the situation in which he was attacked. He did not reply to any. He might have said wrong things about me in private meetings but he never said anything against me in public. So Chankia Jee once again I have to disappoint you and would not take the bait and attack some one who is not part of this debate.
However if Majid Tramboo wants to open a debate based on the issues raised by Fake Man, he is welcome. I know Majid Tramboo won’t do it, because we both know what facts are.
As far as this Fake Man is concerned he likes to twist words, tell lies and confuse people. He has been trained to do this. For example, I wrote: ‘More than 150 people joined us last month alone, and that is worrying to your bosses’. Fake man turned it around likce this: ‘You say 150 people have joined your email party in 240 days’.
Fake man, debate was intellectual and academic, as to why we are not so influential. You, because of your training and experience in deceit and spreading lies have turned it to a personal one. In my opinion it is unproductive although it helps to explain certain points, but you would love it as it helps to run your kitchen, but I have better things to do, so after this I would exercise restraint.
Books
My books are available in all libraries in AJK. All college and university libraries in AJK and some High School libraries as well. Some of them have been translated from English to Urdu that people who don’t know English could also read them. They are with all Kashmiri nationalist leaders in AJK and Pakistan, all the nationalist political activists in AJK and Pakistan.
Many leaders, political activists and members of Kashnet have copies. Sardar Nasim Iqbal, a leader of JKLF and Head of Diplomatic Committee requested some books many months ago. He was given some books in Belgium in December 2008.
At the time of launching ceremony of my last book in Mirpur ‘If not self determination then what?’ (which was launched by Shaukat Maqbool Butt President of JKNLF) most of the leaders from Kashmiri nationalist parties were present, which included: Shaukat Maqbool Butt, Col Wajhat Mirza, former President of APNA, Col Nadir Hussain from Gilgit and Baltistan, Rauf Kashmiri, Chair of JKLF (Rauf Group), Sardar Ishtiaq, Secretary General JKPNP, Arif Shaihid Secretary General JKNLF, Abbas Butt, (President of JKLF at that time) now Chair of KNP, Professors Rafiq Bhatti, and many other professors from different colleges and AJK University who did appraisal of the book. Also some people representing NSF groups, and other Kashmiri political parties and leaders of civil society groups were present. There were more than 250 people present which included more than 70 ladies.
A book called ‘Different Perspective on Kashmir’ was launched by Professor Khaleeq who is head of JKNAP and known academic and a nationalist leader. He also wrote an introduction to the book. Shaukat Maqbool Butt wrote an introduction to another book. In this function once again all nationalist leaders were present; of course Amanullah Khan was not there because we don’t regard him nationalist anymore; but leaders of Yasin group were present and they addressed the gathering.
Another book, ‘Kashmir dispute as I see it’, was launched by a very prominent figure who is respected in Kashmiri politics and legal circles, Chief Justice Abdul Majid Malik. He was President of Liberation League. He is the one who gave the famous High Court decision on legal status of areas of Gilgita and Baltistan.
20 copies of my each book go to the USA Embassy, and other diplomatic missions also take copies according to their requirements. My new book titled, ‘Struggle for independence, Jihad or a proxy war’ is also published in December 2008. A prominent Parliamentarian Baroness Emma Nicholson who authored the Kashmir report (Kashmir: present situation and future prospects) which was passed by a thumping majority in the EU Parliament has written an introduction to this.
I don’t want to keep on talking about my work and books, all I would suggest to you is to change your residence – there is a limit to what you can see from the well.
Position of parties
As for position of JKLF Yasin and Aman groups are concerned I know their strength. Aman group on the Indian side of Kashmir exist only on papers; and those who march out with Yasin Malik are not his members but people who have grievances against India. They will join a demonstration of any party. If I don’t know Yasin groups structure and strength then who would. Man became adhoc Chair in 1995 and he continues with that position. There is no structure, no elections and no system of check and balance.
When I was President of JKLF Yasin group, I once phoned a very senior party leader and asked him how was the party doing. You know what he said: ‘the party is in jail these days’. Yasin was in jail at that time and as there was no structure or system in place, which he would not allow to develop because the system could limit his powers; hence that comment.
In AJK both Yasin group and Aman group are very weak on ground. Two years ago Aman group announced a public meeting in Mirpur (Nangi) in which only 18 people turned up and the meeting or ‘jalsa’ was cancelled.
Same is the situation with the Yasin group, names of both leaders, thanks to Pakistani media and help of agencies are there, but they are very weak on ground.
In UK Yasin group cannot get more than 12 people if they want to have a public meeting or demonstration. Once Aman group with help of their allies in pro Pakistan Alliance Rabta Committee once had a demonstration outside the Indian High Commission in which 14 people turned up. Ali Kiani, Allah bless his soul, as a Staff Reporter of daily Jang went to cover the demonstration. He commented: ‘in this Alliance (Rabta Committee) there are 11 parties, and there were 11 demonstrators it was understandable 1 person representing each party, but question is who were the remaining three’? So don’t go by what Pakistan media make it appear.
Hman Rights abuse on the Pakistani side
No one has ever said that same level of human rights abuse goes on in both parts of Kashmir. I gave reasons why there is less abuse on the Pakistani side, but emphasised that if people of AJK and Gilgit and Baltistan take gun from India and use it against Pakistan, as people of Indian side of Kashmir have done, then they will know what state oppression is.
Perhaps people can learn lessons of East Pakistan, FATA, Swat and other parts of Frontier where Jet fighters, tanks, artillery and helicopter gun ships are in action and anyone who is killed is declared a terrorist and ‘shar passend’ and those who die include children, women and old. Their houses are bulldozed and their crops are burnt and people are killed.
Indians have killed innocent people there is no doubt about it, and that cannot be justified by any civilised person. I am not ‘glorifying’ India but fact remains that even when they had almost lost the Valley in 1990/91, they did not use jet fighters or tanks to control militancy.
In response to human rights violations by some bad militants and by some Pakistani troops on this side of the LOC, Shafqat Inquilabi from Gilgit and Baltistan had strength of character and courage to explain what goes on there, while other nationalists from AJK and G&B are silent spectators. END
Some of you might have followed the debate which started as a result of my article ‘Why Indians are influential’? After explaining some of the achievements of the Indians abroad I emphasised that we Kashmiris abroad should stop giving receptions and parties to patwaris, inspectors and politicians who visit from back home; and use our resources to educate our children that they could become more competitive.
Some people get electrified when you associate anything good with India. They want India and Pakistan in a state of war all the time, as it suites their agenda. Others didn’t want Kashmiris from Azad Kashmir to be empowered by getting educated, as my message was to discard bad traditions and invest in future of their children. This group, which represents imperial powers and knows very well that it is easy to control and manipulate uneducated lot; and moreover they don’t their receptions and other perks to stop.
I said in one post that some people will criticise me no matter what I do, and even if I pray they will say folding of my hands was not correct. There are three reasons for this opposition: Personal dislike and personal matters, ideological differences and it brings bread and butter to the house.
If by criticising me it helps them to run their kitchen I don’t mind what they are saying about me.
I welcome criticism as long if it is not indecent. Also I respect all as long as they use their own names to express their opinion or criticise. Siraj Sahib criticised me – he was sincere in his criticism and even though he used some harsh words and I disagreed with him, I called him brother and respected his opinion. In return he realised his mistake, and as a decent man he apologised for his harsh words; and his image in my opinion and in opinion of others has enhanced ten fold.
Chankia Jee
What I dislike is people using fake Kashnet id’s to attack genuine people involved in the struggle. Chankia Jee, who is master of lies, deceit and back stabbing, has used many fake Id’s in the past to attack me and set me up for a fight with others. He is doing it again. I though he might change, but I was wrong, nature DOES NOT change. If Chankia Jee uses his own ID and ask me questions I will reply him appropriately.
In the past Chankia jee, by using fake ID, made some allegations against me and made it appear as if Barrister Majid Tramboo was doing it. He thought I would take the bait. I did not take, and simply replied that all allegations were unfounded and baseless.
Barrister Majid Tramboo and I worked as a team in the JKLF and worked very effectively. After differences he had his way and I had mine. I was angry as I thought he let me down (of course he has his own opinion on the matter), and wrote some articles explaining the situation in which he was attacked. He did not reply to any. He might have said wrong things about me in private meetings but he never said anything against me in public. So Chankia Jee once again I have to disappoint you and would not take the bait and attack some one who is not part of this debate.
However if Majid Tramboo wants to open a debate based on the issues raised by Fake Man, he is welcome. I know Majid Tramboo won’t do it, because we both know what facts are.
As far as this Fake Man is concerned he likes to twist words, tell lies and confuse people. He has been trained to do this. For example, I wrote: ‘More than 150 people joined us last month alone, and that is worrying to your bosses’. Fake man turned it around likce this: ‘You say 150 people have joined your email party in 240 days’.
Fake man, debate was intellectual and academic, as to why we are not so influential. You, because of your training and experience in deceit and spreading lies have turned it to a personal one. In my opinion it is unproductive although it helps to explain certain points, but you would love it as it helps to run your kitchen, but I have better things to do, so after this I would exercise restraint.
Books
My books are available in all libraries in AJK. All college and university libraries in AJK and some High School libraries as well. Some of them have been translated from English to Urdu that people who don’t know English could also read them. They are with all Kashmiri nationalist leaders in AJK and Pakistan, all the nationalist political activists in AJK and Pakistan.
Many leaders, political activists and members of Kashnet have copies. Sardar Nasim Iqbal, a leader of JKLF and Head of Diplomatic Committee requested some books many months ago. He was given some books in Belgium in December 2008.
At the time of launching ceremony of my last book in Mirpur ‘If not self determination then what?’ (which was launched by Shaukat Maqbool Butt President of JKNLF) most of the leaders from Kashmiri nationalist parties were present, which included: Shaukat Maqbool Butt, Col Wajhat Mirza, former President of APNA, Col Nadir Hussain from Gilgit and Baltistan, Rauf Kashmiri, Chair of JKLF (Rauf Group), Sardar Ishtiaq, Secretary General JKPNP, Arif Shaihid Secretary General JKNLF, Abbas Butt, (President of JKLF at that time) now Chair of KNP, Professors Rafiq Bhatti, and many other professors from different colleges and AJK University who did appraisal of the book. Also some people representing NSF groups, and other Kashmiri political parties and leaders of civil society groups were present. There were more than 250 people present which included more than 70 ladies.
A book called ‘Different Perspective on Kashmir’ was launched by Professor Khaleeq who is head of JKNAP and known academic and a nationalist leader. He also wrote an introduction to the book. Shaukat Maqbool Butt wrote an introduction to another book. In this function once again all nationalist leaders were present; of course Amanullah Khan was not there because we don’t regard him nationalist anymore; but leaders of Yasin group were present and they addressed the gathering.
Another book, ‘Kashmir dispute as I see it’, was launched by a very prominent figure who is respected in Kashmiri politics and legal circles, Chief Justice Abdul Majid Malik. He was President of Liberation League. He is the one who gave the famous High Court decision on legal status of areas of Gilgita and Baltistan.
20 copies of my each book go to the USA Embassy, and other diplomatic missions also take copies according to their requirements. My new book titled, ‘Struggle for independence, Jihad or a proxy war’ is also published in December 2008. A prominent Parliamentarian Baroness Emma Nicholson who authored the Kashmir report (Kashmir: present situation and future prospects) which was passed by a thumping majority in the EU Parliament has written an introduction to this.
I don’t want to keep on talking about my work and books, all I would suggest to you is to change your residence – there is a limit to what you can see from the well.
Position of parties
As for position of JKLF Yasin and Aman groups are concerned I know their strength. Aman group on the Indian side of Kashmir exist only on papers; and those who march out with Yasin Malik are not his members but people who have grievances against India. They will join a demonstration of any party. If I don’t know Yasin groups structure and strength then who would. Man became adhoc Chair in 1995 and he continues with that position. There is no structure, no elections and no system of check and balance.
When I was President of JKLF Yasin group, I once phoned a very senior party leader and asked him how was the party doing. You know what he said: ‘the party is in jail these days’. Yasin was in jail at that time and as there was no structure or system in place, which he would not allow to develop because the system could limit his powers; hence that comment.
In AJK both Yasin group and Aman group are very weak on ground. Two years ago Aman group announced a public meeting in Mirpur (Nangi) in which only 18 people turned up and the meeting or ‘jalsa’ was cancelled.
Same is the situation with the Yasin group, names of both leaders, thanks to Pakistani media and help of agencies are there, but they are very weak on ground.
In UK Yasin group cannot get more than 12 people if they want to have a public meeting or demonstration. Once Aman group with help of their allies in pro Pakistan Alliance Rabta Committee once had a demonstration outside the Indian High Commission in which 14 people turned up. Ali Kiani, Allah bless his soul, as a Staff Reporter of daily Jang went to cover the demonstration. He commented: ‘in this Alliance (Rabta Committee) there are 11 parties, and there were 11 demonstrators it was understandable 1 person representing each party, but question is who were the remaining three’? So don’t go by what Pakistan media make it appear.
Hman Rights abuse on the Pakistani side
No one has ever said that same level of human rights abuse goes on in both parts of Kashmir. I gave reasons why there is less abuse on the Pakistani side, but emphasised that if people of AJK and Gilgit and Baltistan take gun from India and use it against Pakistan, as people of Indian side of Kashmir have done, then they will know what state oppression is.
Perhaps people can learn lessons of East Pakistan, FATA, Swat and other parts of Frontier where Jet fighters, tanks, artillery and helicopter gun ships are in action and anyone who is killed is declared a terrorist and ‘shar passend’ and those who die include children, women and old. Their houses are bulldozed and their crops are burnt and people are killed.
Indians have killed innocent people there is no doubt about it, and that cannot be justified by any civilised person. I am not ‘glorifying’ India but fact remains that even when they had almost lost the Valley in 1990/91, they did not use jet fighters or tanks to control militancy.
In response to human rights violations by some bad militants and by some Pakistani troops on this side of the LOC, Shafqat Inquilabi from Gilgit and Baltistan had strength of character and courage to explain what goes on there, while other nationalists from AJK and G&B are silent spectators. END
Sunday, 11 January 2009
He is ‘Proud to be Pakistani’
He is ‘Proud to be Pakistani’
Dr Shabir Choudhry 11 January 2009
In my article on achievements of Indians I never said there was no poverty in India, or there were no problems there. Most of my critics commented on things which were not part of the article. One can write 100 books on a big country like India and still might not be able to encompass every aspect of the society and government to the satisfaction of all; and I only wrote a small article and these critics expected me to include every aspect of the Indian life in it.
It is not possible to achieve this no matter what your wishes are. I want to leave that and move on, as there is more to life then to spend time and energy to persuade those who don’t want to be persuaded. Allah SWT is Almighty and all knowing, and yet not every one agrees with Allah, His wisdom and way of life He has ordered us to follow. I am no one in this respect, and don’t expect every one to agree with me; especially those who have myopic view of politics and are rewarded by outside forces for their activities and will never agree with true Kashmiris.
My message was that people from Pakistan and Jammu and Kashmir should invest in education and new technology. They must pay special attention to education of their children, and provide them tuition and necessary facilities, instead of spending money on receptions and big advertisements in newspapers to welcome politicians and other civil servants from back home. This message was misunderstood and some people took that as glorifying Indian achievements; and others thought it was a good opportunity to settle some old scores or please their political masters.
A Pakistani reader of mine has sent me some data about Pakistan with a title ‘Proud to be Pakistani’. From my personal research, knowledge and experience, I know a number of things he has sent as facts are totally wrong. For example, he thinks Jammu and Kashmir is part of Pakistan, and based some of his data on this wrong assumption. I cannot confirm authenticity of the rest of the data he has sent.
To him construction of Taj Mahal was a big achievement of Muslims. To some, may be it was, but I wish Emperor Shah Jehan had used that money and effort to establish a university and colleges that people could have had access to education, which could have made them more competitive; and perhaps could have helped them to fight the enemies bit better.
He is proud that ‘Pakistan has K2, second highest mountain in the world; some of the longest glaciers outside polar, and so many rivers are in Pakistan’. K2 is not in Pakistan, but it is in Gilgit and Baltistan which is part of former State of Jammu and Kashmir. These glaciers are also in Gilgit and Baltistan, and some of rivers he mentioned also flow from Kashmir to Pakistan. In any case mountains, glaciers and rivers are gifts of the Almighty and not something created by the Pakistanis. It is unfortunate that despite Allah’s gifts in form of abundance water and other natural resources Pakistani governments have not been able to make proper use of them, hence Pakistan is facing the problems related to shortage of food, water, electricity etc.
I am presenting some of the data and let people draw their own conclusions, he says Pakistan is: ‘Modern, Progressive, and Dynamic State, world's 5th largest democracy, one of the fastest growing economy in the world, 6th largest standing armed forces – 0.7 Million strong, 300 dailies, 400 weeklies and 700 periodicals, GDP $128.83 Billion (GDP rate 7%), 7th largest pool of scientists and engineers in the World, one of the youngest workforce, a nation on the road to progress and advancement’.
I let people decide if Pakistan is on road to progress and advancement or struggling to survive as a nation state because of maladministration, civil war, destruction and extremism.
He further claims that Pakistan has: ‘More than 150 universities, world's 9th biggest producer of cotton, largest network of water distribution canals in the world, third largest producer of milk, fifth largest producer of dates, world champion in cricket, hockey, squash, wrestling and snooker, established nuclear power, JF17 Thunder completely built in Pakistan, AGOSTA 90b submarines- Al-Khalid Tank completely built in Pakistan, indigenously developed nuclear weapon carrying missiles, complete aircraft rebuilding complex in Kamra and indigenous manufacturing of pilot less aircraft, Uqaab.’
This friend claims that ‘5% of doctors, 6% of scientists, 9% of NASA scientists, 10% of Microsoft employees, 6% of IBM employees, 9% of INTEL scientists and 7% of XEROX employees in the USA are Pakistanis. Pakistan is among seven countries that launch their own satellites. Pakistan is one of the world's largest jewellery and precious gems exporter in the world; its exports were worth $ 48 Million in 2007. About 4 out of 10 precious stones sold anywhere in the world, pass through Pakistan’.
Apart from that General Electric has 2,600 Pakistani employees, Hewlett-Packard has 1,200, American Express has 1,500 and Dell has 2,200. Pakistani Overseas Work Force is 7.5 Million, Pakistan has 80 Million Cell phone Users and Dr. Abdus Salam won Nobel Prize in Physics in 1979. Trade of medicinal plants has crossed $ 500M
I am using this data in my article, but I regret I don’t know if it is accurate. I have produced this to show that I have nothing against the state of Pakistan or achievements of the Pakistani people. I want them to abandon out of date traditions and extremism, and divert their resources to educate their children that they become more competitive and good citizens. My struggle is against injustice, extremism and ignorance. I want Pakistan to become economically and democratically strong, that it can become stable and can live in peace with its neighbours.
But if Pakistani ruling elite, writers and Jihadi groups use religion, lies and fabricate facts to encroach my rights and rights of people of Jammu and Kashmir, then I cannot be expected to remain silent. People are at liberty to call me whatever suits them, or whatever helps them to run their kitchen.
All experts on South Asia and Pakistan have issued warning calls that Pakistan as a nation state is in serious problems; and its future is bleak and unpredictable. Some Pakistani experts and journalists have also issued similar warnings. But most Pakistani brothers are not in a mood to listen to any criticism or suggestion as they see it part of some conspiracy. They had similar attitude in 1970/71. Every politician is carrying a tag with allegations; and now even people in security services and with military background are also included in this.
Despite that we have some Kashmiris yelling Pakistan Zindabad, hence they create divisions and confuse the issue. If they do this out of conviction I will respect that because they have right to hold an opinion and express it, but if they do it because of rewards then I will continue my jihad against them.
Some people claim Kashmiris shout ‘Pakistan zindabad’ in order to tease India; they don’t actually want to join Pakistan. They know Indians hate to hear this slogan; and because they dislike India they will do anything to upset them. This slogan may be annoying to the Indians but it is also causing deep divisions among the Kashmiri groups and sending out wrong signals; so it is not prudent to use it as a tactic either.
We people of Jammu and Kashmir must think as a Kashmiris and must promote and protect a Kashmiri interest. We must not promote or do anything which supports claims and interests of Islamabad and New Delhi. Both countries have resources and established set up to promote their national interests.
Writer is a Spokesman of Kashmir National Party, political analyst and author of many books and booklets. Also he is Director Institute of Kashmir Affairs. Email: drshabirchoudhry@gmail.com
To view other articles see my blog: www.drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com
Dr Shabir Choudhry 11 January 2009
In my article on achievements of Indians I never said there was no poverty in India, or there were no problems there. Most of my critics commented on things which were not part of the article. One can write 100 books on a big country like India and still might not be able to encompass every aspect of the society and government to the satisfaction of all; and I only wrote a small article and these critics expected me to include every aspect of the Indian life in it.
It is not possible to achieve this no matter what your wishes are. I want to leave that and move on, as there is more to life then to spend time and energy to persuade those who don’t want to be persuaded. Allah SWT is Almighty and all knowing, and yet not every one agrees with Allah, His wisdom and way of life He has ordered us to follow. I am no one in this respect, and don’t expect every one to agree with me; especially those who have myopic view of politics and are rewarded by outside forces for their activities and will never agree with true Kashmiris.
My message was that people from Pakistan and Jammu and Kashmir should invest in education and new technology. They must pay special attention to education of their children, and provide them tuition and necessary facilities, instead of spending money on receptions and big advertisements in newspapers to welcome politicians and other civil servants from back home. This message was misunderstood and some people took that as glorifying Indian achievements; and others thought it was a good opportunity to settle some old scores or please their political masters.
A Pakistani reader of mine has sent me some data about Pakistan with a title ‘Proud to be Pakistani’. From my personal research, knowledge and experience, I know a number of things he has sent as facts are totally wrong. For example, he thinks Jammu and Kashmir is part of Pakistan, and based some of his data on this wrong assumption. I cannot confirm authenticity of the rest of the data he has sent.
To him construction of Taj Mahal was a big achievement of Muslims. To some, may be it was, but I wish Emperor Shah Jehan had used that money and effort to establish a university and colleges that people could have had access to education, which could have made them more competitive; and perhaps could have helped them to fight the enemies bit better.
He is proud that ‘Pakistan has K2, second highest mountain in the world; some of the longest glaciers outside polar, and so many rivers are in Pakistan’. K2 is not in Pakistan, but it is in Gilgit and Baltistan which is part of former State of Jammu and Kashmir. These glaciers are also in Gilgit and Baltistan, and some of rivers he mentioned also flow from Kashmir to Pakistan. In any case mountains, glaciers and rivers are gifts of the Almighty and not something created by the Pakistanis. It is unfortunate that despite Allah’s gifts in form of abundance water and other natural resources Pakistani governments have not been able to make proper use of them, hence Pakistan is facing the problems related to shortage of food, water, electricity etc.
I am presenting some of the data and let people draw their own conclusions, he says Pakistan is: ‘Modern, Progressive, and Dynamic State, world's 5th largest democracy, one of the fastest growing economy in the world, 6th largest standing armed forces – 0.7 Million strong, 300 dailies, 400 weeklies and 700 periodicals, GDP $128.83 Billion (GDP rate 7%), 7th largest pool of scientists and engineers in the World, one of the youngest workforce, a nation on the road to progress and advancement’.
I let people decide if Pakistan is on road to progress and advancement or struggling to survive as a nation state because of maladministration, civil war, destruction and extremism.
He further claims that Pakistan has: ‘More than 150 universities, world's 9th biggest producer of cotton, largest network of water distribution canals in the world, third largest producer of milk, fifth largest producer of dates, world champion in cricket, hockey, squash, wrestling and snooker, established nuclear power, JF17 Thunder completely built in Pakistan, AGOSTA 90b submarines- Al-Khalid Tank completely built in Pakistan, indigenously developed nuclear weapon carrying missiles, complete aircraft rebuilding complex in Kamra and indigenous manufacturing of pilot less aircraft, Uqaab.’
This friend claims that ‘5% of doctors, 6% of scientists, 9% of NASA scientists, 10% of Microsoft employees, 6% of IBM employees, 9% of INTEL scientists and 7% of XEROX employees in the USA are Pakistanis. Pakistan is among seven countries that launch their own satellites. Pakistan is one of the world's largest jewellery and precious gems exporter in the world; its exports were worth $ 48 Million in 2007. About 4 out of 10 precious stones sold anywhere in the world, pass through Pakistan’.
Apart from that General Electric has 2,600 Pakistani employees, Hewlett-Packard has 1,200, American Express has 1,500 and Dell has 2,200. Pakistani Overseas Work Force is 7.5 Million, Pakistan has 80 Million Cell phone Users and Dr. Abdus Salam won Nobel Prize in Physics in 1979. Trade of medicinal plants has crossed $ 500M
I am using this data in my article, but I regret I don’t know if it is accurate. I have produced this to show that I have nothing against the state of Pakistan or achievements of the Pakistani people. I want them to abandon out of date traditions and extremism, and divert their resources to educate their children that they become more competitive and good citizens. My struggle is against injustice, extremism and ignorance. I want Pakistan to become economically and democratically strong, that it can become stable and can live in peace with its neighbours.
But if Pakistani ruling elite, writers and Jihadi groups use religion, lies and fabricate facts to encroach my rights and rights of people of Jammu and Kashmir, then I cannot be expected to remain silent. People are at liberty to call me whatever suits them, or whatever helps them to run their kitchen.
All experts on South Asia and Pakistan have issued warning calls that Pakistan as a nation state is in serious problems; and its future is bleak and unpredictable. Some Pakistani experts and journalists have also issued similar warnings. But most Pakistani brothers are not in a mood to listen to any criticism or suggestion as they see it part of some conspiracy. They had similar attitude in 1970/71. Every politician is carrying a tag with allegations; and now even people in security services and with military background are also included in this.
Despite that we have some Kashmiris yelling Pakistan Zindabad, hence they create divisions and confuse the issue. If they do this out of conviction I will respect that because they have right to hold an opinion and express it, but if they do it because of rewards then I will continue my jihad against them.
Some people claim Kashmiris shout ‘Pakistan zindabad’ in order to tease India; they don’t actually want to join Pakistan. They know Indians hate to hear this slogan; and because they dislike India they will do anything to upset them. This slogan may be annoying to the Indians but it is also causing deep divisions among the Kashmiri groups and sending out wrong signals; so it is not prudent to use it as a tactic either.
We people of Jammu and Kashmir must think as a Kashmiris and must promote and protect a Kashmiri interest. We must not promote or do anything which supports claims and interests of Islamabad and New Delhi. Both countries have resources and established set up to promote their national interests.
Writer is a Spokesman of Kashmir National Party, political analyst and author of many books and booklets. Also he is Director Institute of Kashmir Affairs. Email: drshabirchoudhry@gmail.com
To view other articles see my blog: www.drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com
Saturday, 10 January 2009
A reply to a critic
Dear Shahid Pervaiz Mir aslamo alaykam
Thank you for your email.
1. I wish our ‘leaders’ were accountable and we Kashmiris had courage to ask them what they are doing and have been doing in our name. I know when people know their leader is wrong, had taken illegal/ unconstitutional action or has betrayed the party or the movement many choose to remain silent because they don’t want to jeopardise their political aspirations. Or sometimes they give in to pressure of colleagues that it is not right time to ask him or hold him to task.
2. Fortunately or unfortunately my upbringing and political growth has been in a liberal and democratic society (Britain); and I have studied and taught politics as a subject. I learnt to call spade a spade and challenged party leaders and others when they were out of step, hence I made many enemies.
3. May be your struggle (and struggle of those whom you regard as leaders) is for ‘separatism’. My struggle on the contrary is not for ‘separatism’. In order to separate something that thing has to be part of something in first place, hence the process of ‘separation’. In my view Jammu and Kashmir is not part of either India or Pakistan, so there is no question of separation. My struggle is for unfettered right of self determination which has been denied to us.
4. I don’t know who you are, where you live and what you stand for; but you are no doubt an intelligent person who knows how to use words. But let me tell you that I started my struggle for united and independent Jammu and Kashmir at the age of 17. In 1977 I was among those who set up the JKLF in 1977, and at that time the struggle was not commercialised; and brief cases full of dollars were not going from one place to another.
5. During the course of this long struggle I must have made mistakes which did not appear mistakes at that time because of trust we bestowed to senior people, inexperience, and because of unavailability of true information at that time. However hand on my heart, I can sincerely and honestly say that I have not worked against the interests of united and independent Jammu and Kashmir, or the Kashmiri struggle. I have not betrayed anyone; however I have been stabbed in the back more than once. While in the JKLF I and my colleagues worked hard to sort out problems of the JKLF and forge unity, but those who wanted the JKLF to be in pieces were more powerful and influential.
6. If you know what I know, or experience what I have experienced in the struggle then your perspective might also change. It is matter of perspective and experience, I am doing what I think is right, under the circumstances, and that is to expose those who have betrayed the blood of innocent people, who have betrayed the movement, who have made it a business. Also expose those who are under cover working for the status quo or accession to Pakistan.
7. You might think it is not appropriate time as it could split the movement or divert attention. This logic was given to us to silence us in 1990s not only by the JKLF people, but also by Pakistanis and at times by Pakistani agency people. Once in a meeting there were some Kashmiri leaders, Pakistani people and some agency people; and issue of working out a strategy against India was being discussed. I expressed my views which were in line with united and independent Jammu and Kashmir and to have a strategy against both occupiers; I talked of problems of people on both sides of the LOC; and requested that we should promote a strategy that the entire state looks disputed and not only the areas under India.
8. There was a strong opposition to my views in the meeting orchestrated by those who were close to the Pakistani agencies. The agency man first praised my skills and contribution, then said, ‘We have worked hard to hook India, and by your articles and statements you are diverting the attention from the Indian occupied Kashmir to this side. We need to focus world attention what goes on in the Valley’.
9. I disagreed with his approach and agenda. Whether you like me or dislike me, it doesn’t bother me a bit, but my struggle is not for the Valley only; and I have courage to say that openly. And I am least interested in what efforts Pakistan has made to ‘hook’ India, and would like to focus the world attention to the Valley and make it disputed. My struggle is to make the entire state disputed; and that fact that there is no militancy on this side of LOC does not make these areas less disputed.
10. In my opinion both parts are occupied, one by India and the other by Pakistan (we keep China out for the time being). I don’t deny (and have never done so in the past) that people of Kashmir have been through hell. They have been killed, tortured, raped and imprisoned. Of course there have been custodial deaths and targeted killings, and it is believed that more than 70 thousand people have lost their lives. It is a very big number, and Indian governments cannot deny human rights violations and killings in Jammu and Kashmir.
11. I don’t need to defend these atrocities, if anything I have always condemned them. But as a rational and practical person with a lot of study and experience I know wherever there is an armed struggle there is bound to be human rights abuse and killing of innocent people. We are not part of India, and we have taken a gun and training from Pakistan to use it against India. Did we expect flowers in return? Indian army did what all forces of occupation do.
12. Take example of Pakistan what did they do to their own Muslim brothers in East Pakistan when they asked for their genuine political rights in 1970/71. Those who fought there and were later imprisoned, tell horrific stories of atrocities, rapes, custodial deaths, in some cases alive burial of rebels, instructions were to kill indiscriminately as the army junta wanted Bengal and not Bengalis. It is estimated that around three million people were butchered.
13. If that is in distant past just see what Pakistan army is doing in FATA and parts of Frontier. They are using F16 fighters, helicopter gun ships, tanks, armoured vehicles to kill and destroy people and houses. Their ‘jihad’ against their own Muslim population continued even in the month of Ramadan which resulted in thousands of deaths and uprooting of more than two lakh people. These victims are Pakistanis; and just imagine what will happen to us if people of Pakistani occupied Kashmir took gun in their hands to use it against Pakistan. Or just ask leaders and members of JK Plebiscite Front who were imprisoned after the Ganga hijacking what happened to them in the Pakistani torture cells.
14. The point I am trying to make is that armies are trained to kill and torture when they are ordered to do. We note that there is very little human rights abuse on the Pakistani side in comparison to the Indian side; and some Kashmiris are buoyant about it. What they forget is that there is no militancy on the Pakistani side as well, which is why there is little human rights abuse; otherwise situation of FATA and Frontier is enough to open eyes of all those who are realistic and are not on the pay role of Pakistan.
15. Now ask yourself why after so many sacrifices and years of bloody struggle Kashmir dispute is still a matter to be resolved by New Delhi and Islamabad. Why we are still not a party to it. It was never our struggle, only our shoulders were used; and we ended up paying huge sacrifices. What was sold as a JKLF struggle by the top JKLF leaders was in actual fact a policy of the Pakistani agencies to keep India engaged in Kashmir; that is why it is called a proxy war, purpose was to keep India bleeding in Kashmir to take revenge of 1971 war, and to ensure that there is no adventurism against the Pakistani borders.
16. Just think that in 1988 Indian side of Kashmir was much better and more advanced than the Pakistani side of Kashmir. We were worse off in every respect and ghulam of Pakistan. Gilgit and Baltistan was, and probably still is, in dark ages in comparison, and is far behind in facilities, development, education and social and political rights in every respect from Jammu and Kashmir, and even from AJK. Amanullah Khan who comes from that area and knows well about the situation and plight of the people was persuaded by the ISI to forget about their own ghulami and start jihad to liberate those who were better off than us.
17. To make matters from bad to worse the struggle was presented as an Islamic one with purpose of establishing an Islamic rule. For this purpose militants from other countries were brought in to Kashmir which changed the fundamental character of our struggle. It no longer appeared to be a Kashmiri struggle; it became part of the so called Islamic fundamentalist movement. This was done at a time when the entire world was against the Islamic fundamentalism; and in a state which is a multi religious and multi ethnic. Aim of those who were controlling the militancy and the struggle through their proxies was to divide the movement and deprive it of support it deserved.
18. Their strategy worked. The movement was divided; non Muslims who were not part of the struggle and perhaps were thinking whether to take part in it or stay out of it, got more alarmed. This strategy provided a powerful tool in hands of India to propagate that it was Pakistan pulling strings and bringing in Jihadis from different countries to create trouble in Kashmir.
19. We people are forcibly divided by the LOC, and we are occupied by two different countries with competing agendas. We face different situation and encounter different problems. Our experience in life helps us to formulate our policies and attitude to different things, therefore we cannot think alike. Our strategy should have been to make the struggle a national struggle. People under the Indian occupation struggle according to their situation; and people under the Pakistani occupation fight for their liberation according to their situation.
20. Of course they could have helped and supported each other, but when one ghulam forgets about his own plight, takes a gun from his occupier and goes across to liberate the other ghulam, it becomes a joke and world view that as a proxy war; especially when citizens of that occupier also pick up guns and join the fight.
21. Many of you and Pakistani governments and their agencies present APHC leaders as representative of the Kashmiri people; truth however is that they cannot win any election even if held under the UN supervision. They don’t even represent Muslims of Srinager, never mind all the Kashmiris. One senior APHC man (hate to call him a leader) Professor Ghani Bhat, openly advocated division of the State. Do you expect me to respect him and follow him - some one who is advocating division of my motherland? It is believed that the other men in the APHC are no different but they have no courage to speak out.
22. Don’t you think it is jihad to speak out against the people who have used the struggle to feather their own nests? Most of them get security from India, get rewards from them, and then question is against whom are they fighting? If Hamas leaders were provided security by the Israeli government would you still believe in their claim that they were fighting against Israel?
23. My friend it is time to open your eyes, and stop blind following. I am not asking you to stop your fight against the Indian rule; in that fight all my energies and abilities are at your disposal, but when you join hands with these proxies who are advancing their personal agenda and the agenda of Pakistan then I cannot remain silent. Allah SWT has bestowed me with education, ability to analyse, speak and write; and dedication to fight for rights of the people of Jammu and Kashmir. I want to honestly discharge that duty no matter what people think. I am answerable to my conscience and Allah SWT, and believe me despite threats and intimidation I have continued my jihad.
24. I hope you understand things bit better now. If however you still want to hold on to your guns, it is your prerogative. You carry on to do what you think is right I will continue with my jihad of speaking truth and exposing hypocrites and collaborators. And as for me it is an end to this discussion.
Wassalam
Dr Shabir Choudhry
Thank you for your email.
1. I wish our ‘leaders’ were accountable and we Kashmiris had courage to ask them what they are doing and have been doing in our name. I know when people know their leader is wrong, had taken illegal/ unconstitutional action or has betrayed the party or the movement many choose to remain silent because they don’t want to jeopardise their political aspirations. Or sometimes they give in to pressure of colleagues that it is not right time to ask him or hold him to task.
2. Fortunately or unfortunately my upbringing and political growth has been in a liberal and democratic society (Britain); and I have studied and taught politics as a subject. I learnt to call spade a spade and challenged party leaders and others when they were out of step, hence I made many enemies.
3. May be your struggle (and struggle of those whom you regard as leaders) is for ‘separatism’. My struggle on the contrary is not for ‘separatism’. In order to separate something that thing has to be part of something in first place, hence the process of ‘separation’. In my view Jammu and Kashmir is not part of either India or Pakistan, so there is no question of separation. My struggle is for unfettered right of self determination which has been denied to us.
4. I don’t know who you are, where you live and what you stand for; but you are no doubt an intelligent person who knows how to use words. But let me tell you that I started my struggle for united and independent Jammu and Kashmir at the age of 17. In 1977 I was among those who set up the JKLF in 1977, and at that time the struggle was not commercialised; and brief cases full of dollars were not going from one place to another.
5. During the course of this long struggle I must have made mistakes which did not appear mistakes at that time because of trust we bestowed to senior people, inexperience, and because of unavailability of true information at that time. However hand on my heart, I can sincerely and honestly say that I have not worked against the interests of united and independent Jammu and Kashmir, or the Kashmiri struggle. I have not betrayed anyone; however I have been stabbed in the back more than once. While in the JKLF I and my colleagues worked hard to sort out problems of the JKLF and forge unity, but those who wanted the JKLF to be in pieces were more powerful and influential.
6. If you know what I know, or experience what I have experienced in the struggle then your perspective might also change. It is matter of perspective and experience, I am doing what I think is right, under the circumstances, and that is to expose those who have betrayed the blood of innocent people, who have betrayed the movement, who have made it a business. Also expose those who are under cover working for the status quo or accession to Pakistan.
7. You might think it is not appropriate time as it could split the movement or divert attention. This logic was given to us to silence us in 1990s not only by the JKLF people, but also by Pakistanis and at times by Pakistani agency people. Once in a meeting there were some Kashmiri leaders, Pakistani people and some agency people; and issue of working out a strategy against India was being discussed. I expressed my views which were in line with united and independent Jammu and Kashmir and to have a strategy against both occupiers; I talked of problems of people on both sides of the LOC; and requested that we should promote a strategy that the entire state looks disputed and not only the areas under India.
8. There was a strong opposition to my views in the meeting orchestrated by those who were close to the Pakistani agencies. The agency man first praised my skills and contribution, then said, ‘We have worked hard to hook India, and by your articles and statements you are diverting the attention from the Indian occupied Kashmir to this side. We need to focus world attention what goes on in the Valley’.
9. I disagreed with his approach and agenda. Whether you like me or dislike me, it doesn’t bother me a bit, but my struggle is not for the Valley only; and I have courage to say that openly. And I am least interested in what efforts Pakistan has made to ‘hook’ India, and would like to focus the world attention to the Valley and make it disputed. My struggle is to make the entire state disputed; and that fact that there is no militancy on this side of LOC does not make these areas less disputed.
10. In my opinion both parts are occupied, one by India and the other by Pakistan (we keep China out for the time being). I don’t deny (and have never done so in the past) that people of Kashmir have been through hell. They have been killed, tortured, raped and imprisoned. Of course there have been custodial deaths and targeted killings, and it is believed that more than 70 thousand people have lost their lives. It is a very big number, and Indian governments cannot deny human rights violations and killings in Jammu and Kashmir.
11. I don’t need to defend these atrocities, if anything I have always condemned them. But as a rational and practical person with a lot of study and experience I know wherever there is an armed struggle there is bound to be human rights abuse and killing of innocent people. We are not part of India, and we have taken a gun and training from Pakistan to use it against India. Did we expect flowers in return? Indian army did what all forces of occupation do.
12. Take example of Pakistan what did they do to their own Muslim brothers in East Pakistan when they asked for their genuine political rights in 1970/71. Those who fought there and were later imprisoned, tell horrific stories of atrocities, rapes, custodial deaths, in some cases alive burial of rebels, instructions were to kill indiscriminately as the army junta wanted Bengal and not Bengalis. It is estimated that around three million people were butchered.
13. If that is in distant past just see what Pakistan army is doing in FATA and parts of Frontier. They are using F16 fighters, helicopter gun ships, tanks, armoured vehicles to kill and destroy people and houses. Their ‘jihad’ against their own Muslim population continued even in the month of Ramadan which resulted in thousands of deaths and uprooting of more than two lakh people. These victims are Pakistanis; and just imagine what will happen to us if people of Pakistani occupied Kashmir took gun in their hands to use it against Pakistan. Or just ask leaders and members of JK Plebiscite Front who were imprisoned after the Ganga hijacking what happened to them in the Pakistani torture cells.
14. The point I am trying to make is that armies are trained to kill and torture when they are ordered to do. We note that there is very little human rights abuse on the Pakistani side in comparison to the Indian side; and some Kashmiris are buoyant about it. What they forget is that there is no militancy on the Pakistani side as well, which is why there is little human rights abuse; otherwise situation of FATA and Frontier is enough to open eyes of all those who are realistic and are not on the pay role of Pakistan.
15. Now ask yourself why after so many sacrifices and years of bloody struggle Kashmir dispute is still a matter to be resolved by New Delhi and Islamabad. Why we are still not a party to it. It was never our struggle, only our shoulders were used; and we ended up paying huge sacrifices. What was sold as a JKLF struggle by the top JKLF leaders was in actual fact a policy of the Pakistani agencies to keep India engaged in Kashmir; that is why it is called a proxy war, purpose was to keep India bleeding in Kashmir to take revenge of 1971 war, and to ensure that there is no adventurism against the Pakistani borders.
16. Just think that in 1988 Indian side of Kashmir was much better and more advanced than the Pakistani side of Kashmir. We were worse off in every respect and ghulam of Pakistan. Gilgit and Baltistan was, and probably still is, in dark ages in comparison, and is far behind in facilities, development, education and social and political rights in every respect from Jammu and Kashmir, and even from AJK. Amanullah Khan who comes from that area and knows well about the situation and plight of the people was persuaded by the ISI to forget about their own ghulami and start jihad to liberate those who were better off than us.
17. To make matters from bad to worse the struggle was presented as an Islamic one with purpose of establishing an Islamic rule. For this purpose militants from other countries were brought in to Kashmir which changed the fundamental character of our struggle. It no longer appeared to be a Kashmiri struggle; it became part of the so called Islamic fundamentalist movement. This was done at a time when the entire world was against the Islamic fundamentalism; and in a state which is a multi religious and multi ethnic. Aim of those who were controlling the militancy and the struggle through their proxies was to divide the movement and deprive it of support it deserved.
18. Their strategy worked. The movement was divided; non Muslims who were not part of the struggle and perhaps were thinking whether to take part in it or stay out of it, got more alarmed. This strategy provided a powerful tool in hands of India to propagate that it was Pakistan pulling strings and bringing in Jihadis from different countries to create trouble in Kashmir.
19. We people are forcibly divided by the LOC, and we are occupied by two different countries with competing agendas. We face different situation and encounter different problems. Our experience in life helps us to formulate our policies and attitude to different things, therefore we cannot think alike. Our strategy should have been to make the struggle a national struggle. People under the Indian occupation struggle according to their situation; and people under the Pakistani occupation fight for their liberation according to their situation.
20. Of course they could have helped and supported each other, but when one ghulam forgets about his own plight, takes a gun from his occupier and goes across to liberate the other ghulam, it becomes a joke and world view that as a proxy war; especially when citizens of that occupier also pick up guns and join the fight.
21. Many of you and Pakistani governments and their agencies present APHC leaders as representative of the Kashmiri people; truth however is that they cannot win any election even if held under the UN supervision. They don’t even represent Muslims of Srinager, never mind all the Kashmiris. One senior APHC man (hate to call him a leader) Professor Ghani Bhat, openly advocated division of the State. Do you expect me to respect him and follow him - some one who is advocating division of my motherland? It is believed that the other men in the APHC are no different but they have no courage to speak out.
22. Don’t you think it is jihad to speak out against the people who have used the struggle to feather their own nests? Most of them get security from India, get rewards from them, and then question is against whom are they fighting? If Hamas leaders were provided security by the Israeli government would you still believe in their claim that they were fighting against Israel?
23. My friend it is time to open your eyes, and stop blind following. I am not asking you to stop your fight against the Indian rule; in that fight all my energies and abilities are at your disposal, but when you join hands with these proxies who are advancing their personal agenda and the agenda of Pakistan then I cannot remain silent. Allah SWT has bestowed me with education, ability to analyse, speak and write; and dedication to fight for rights of the people of Jammu and Kashmir. I want to honestly discharge that duty no matter what people think. I am answerable to my conscience and Allah SWT, and believe me despite threats and intimidation I have continued my jihad.
24. I hope you understand things bit better now. If however you still want to hold on to your guns, it is your prerogative. You carry on to do what you think is right I will continue with my jihad of speaking truth and exposing hypocrites and collaborators. And as for me it is an end to this discussion.
Wassalam
Dr Shabir Choudhry
Tuesday, 6 January 2009
Why people become terrorists?
Why people become terrorists?
Dr Shabir Choudhry 06 January 2009
I felt like strangling this man; and then declare that I have taken revenge for Gaza. I was in a hospital recovering from heart procedure which was done to me in hospital in London when Israel unleashed a reign of terror on innocent people of Gaza.
I am educated man with very moderate views; and have advanced peace and politics of tolerance for many years. I am 54 years old and suffer from heart ailment since last year; yet after seeing scenes on TV about Gaza, my blood started boiling with anger and sense of helplessness.
Opposite my bed was another patient who was a Jew, he also had a small skull – cap on his head. He was younger than me and perhaps stronger as well. I had many wires attached to my body to monitor my heart and blood pressure; and he had none, which also meant he was in a better condition than me. He had personally done no harm to me and perhaps was a good man, but at that moment in time he appeared to me a party to ‘war crimes’ committed by the Zionist government.
I told my wife what was going through my mind and asked her to take off these wires that I could sort him out. She was also angry after seeing what was happening in Gaza, but she was shocked to hear my views. More than once I said to her that I wanted to go, and at least, slap on his face.
I know it was wrong of me to think like that but for how long one can remain silent when humanity is trampling under boots of Zionists in Gaza, when innocent children are deprived of food and medicine; when civilians are fired at by F16, missiles, helicopter gun ships and their houses are demolished by tanks and bulldozers. For how long can you look on the other side when injured women, old and children are in hospital with no medicine and no electricity that they could be treated?
If at this age and with my health condition I felt like that, what will be the reaction of those who are young, fit, not so moderate and less educated? Would they not feel obliged to go and fight all those who are responsible for this human catastrophe? And one wonders is Israel alone in this? What is the role of the USA and others in this? And more disturbing is the lamb’s silence of so called Muslim World or Umma. Someone rightly said that OIC stands for organisation of impotent countries.
Before the USA and Britain started their illegal and immoral war against Iraq I wrote letters to Tony Blair and George Bush requesting them not to start their aggression as that ‘will create chaos and instability and you will give birth to future ‘terrorists’ as people will take revenge for barbarism unleashed in name of ‘liberation’. I further wrote: ‘this theory that one can end terrorism with more terrorism has not worked in the past and it is doomed to fail in Iraq as well, even though manipulators like Tony Blair, Jack Straw, Bush, Powel and Rumsfeld are subscribing to it and actively following it.’
Of course there was no reason for them to listen to person like me as they had their own plans; and whether there were any weapons of mass destruction or not they had to follow the script prepared for them by those who always work from behind the scenes. What they have brought to Iraq and elsewhere is death and destruction, but ‘terrorism’ is on the rise and spreading like a wild fire. Many critics believe that this is what they intended to achieve as it provides them with excuse to continue with their policies and station their forces in those areas.
All those who want to end terrorism by inflicting pain and suffering on innocent people; or by unleashing state terrorism to end terrorism are trying to put out fire with petrol. That applies to all those countries that are using their superior weapons to oppress and kill people be it in Iraq, Palestine, Afghanistan, FATA, Kashmir Chechnya or elsewhere.
I oppose terrorism and hatred, but I do support peoples right to defend themselves, defend their families and defend their property. Perhaps Israel and her allies are unhappy because they expect people of Gaza no to protest and take everything with smile on their face.
It is wrong to oppress but it is equally wrong to be oppressed and remain silent. I don’t support killing of innocent people whether it is done by suicide bombers are by F16s or missiles, but how can you stop or control a young man who has lost everything in a missile attack or by shelling of helicopter gun ship? I can’t tell him not to fight back or don’t choose this weapon to fight.
He has no access to F16, helicopters, cluster bombs and tanks; all he has is his life and determination to take revenge. And when he sacrifices his life in taking revenge with home made weapons he is declared as a ‘terrorist’; but those who are firing at him and his people from a safety of cock pit of F16 or a safety of a tank, they are declared as brave security men fighting the ‘terrorists’ and fighting for ‘freedom’. What hypocrisy is this?
At my age and with my health condition I might not be a suitable candidate to be recruited for any group which are declared as ‘terrorist groups’ by those who plan and spread terrorism by using their state resources in order to ensure that their arms business and their economies keep flourishing; and their control on international affairs remains strong. But now I understand how hard these people have to work to plan a situation to create new terrorists that their dirty game could continue.
People are born free people. At that age they are simple, loving and innocent - they are not ‘terrorists’ when they are born. It is the society, it is injustice it is denial of their basic rights and oppression which makes them terrorists. Who should be held responsible – a person who is oppressed and wants to fight back or those who have made him a terrorist.
Writer is a Spokesman of Kashmir National Party, political analyst and author of many books and booklets. Also he is Director Institute of Kashmir Affairs. Email: drshabirchoudhry@gmail.com
To view other articles see my blog: http://www.drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com/
Dr Shabir Choudhry 06 January 2009
I felt like strangling this man; and then declare that I have taken revenge for Gaza. I was in a hospital recovering from heart procedure which was done to me in hospital in London when Israel unleashed a reign of terror on innocent people of Gaza.
I am educated man with very moderate views; and have advanced peace and politics of tolerance for many years. I am 54 years old and suffer from heart ailment since last year; yet after seeing scenes on TV about Gaza, my blood started boiling with anger and sense of helplessness.
Opposite my bed was another patient who was a Jew, he also had a small skull – cap on his head. He was younger than me and perhaps stronger as well. I had many wires attached to my body to monitor my heart and blood pressure; and he had none, which also meant he was in a better condition than me. He had personally done no harm to me and perhaps was a good man, but at that moment in time he appeared to me a party to ‘war crimes’ committed by the Zionist government.
I told my wife what was going through my mind and asked her to take off these wires that I could sort him out. She was also angry after seeing what was happening in Gaza, but she was shocked to hear my views. More than once I said to her that I wanted to go, and at least, slap on his face.
I know it was wrong of me to think like that but for how long one can remain silent when humanity is trampling under boots of Zionists in Gaza, when innocent children are deprived of food and medicine; when civilians are fired at by F16, missiles, helicopter gun ships and their houses are demolished by tanks and bulldozers. For how long can you look on the other side when injured women, old and children are in hospital with no medicine and no electricity that they could be treated?
If at this age and with my health condition I felt like that, what will be the reaction of those who are young, fit, not so moderate and less educated? Would they not feel obliged to go and fight all those who are responsible for this human catastrophe? And one wonders is Israel alone in this? What is the role of the USA and others in this? And more disturbing is the lamb’s silence of so called Muslim World or Umma. Someone rightly said that OIC stands for organisation of impotent countries.
Before the USA and Britain started their illegal and immoral war against Iraq I wrote letters to Tony Blair and George Bush requesting them not to start their aggression as that ‘will create chaos and instability and you will give birth to future ‘terrorists’ as people will take revenge for barbarism unleashed in name of ‘liberation’. I further wrote: ‘this theory that one can end terrorism with more terrorism has not worked in the past and it is doomed to fail in Iraq as well, even though manipulators like Tony Blair, Jack Straw, Bush, Powel and Rumsfeld are subscribing to it and actively following it.’
Of course there was no reason for them to listen to person like me as they had their own plans; and whether there were any weapons of mass destruction or not they had to follow the script prepared for them by those who always work from behind the scenes. What they have brought to Iraq and elsewhere is death and destruction, but ‘terrorism’ is on the rise and spreading like a wild fire. Many critics believe that this is what they intended to achieve as it provides them with excuse to continue with their policies and station their forces in those areas.
All those who want to end terrorism by inflicting pain and suffering on innocent people; or by unleashing state terrorism to end terrorism are trying to put out fire with petrol. That applies to all those countries that are using their superior weapons to oppress and kill people be it in Iraq, Palestine, Afghanistan, FATA, Kashmir Chechnya or elsewhere.
I oppose terrorism and hatred, but I do support peoples right to defend themselves, defend their families and defend their property. Perhaps Israel and her allies are unhappy because they expect people of Gaza no to protest and take everything with smile on their face.
It is wrong to oppress but it is equally wrong to be oppressed and remain silent. I don’t support killing of innocent people whether it is done by suicide bombers are by F16s or missiles, but how can you stop or control a young man who has lost everything in a missile attack or by shelling of helicopter gun ship? I can’t tell him not to fight back or don’t choose this weapon to fight.
He has no access to F16, helicopters, cluster bombs and tanks; all he has is his life and determination to take revenge. And when he sacrifices his life in taking revenge with home made weapons he is declared as a ‘terrorist’; but those who are firing at him and his people from a safety of cock pit of F16 or a safety of a tank, they are declared as brave security men fighting the ‘terrorists’ and fighting for ‘freedom’. What hypocrisy is this?
At my age and with my health condition I might not be a suitable candidate to be recruited for any group which are declared as ‘terrorist groups’ by those who plan and spread terrorism by using their state resources in order to ensure that their arms business and their economies keep flourishing; and their control on international affairs remains strong. But now I understand how hard these people have to work to plan a situation to create new terrorists that their dirty game could continue.
People are born free people. At that age they are simple, loving and innocent - they are not ‘terrorists’ when they are born. It is the society, it is injustice it is denial of their basic rights and oppression which makes them terrorists. Who should be held responsible – a person who is oppressed and wants to fight back or those who have made him a terrorist.
Writer is a Spokesman of Kashmir National Party, political analyst and author of many books and booklets. Also he is Director Institute of Kashmir Affairs. Email: drshabirchoudhry@gmail.com
To view other articles see my blog: http://www.drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com/
Monday, 5 January 2009
My response to critics, Dr Shabir Choudhry
My response to critics, Dr Shabir Choudhry
First Reply
1. I have looked at your email message carefully and note that you are also an educated person, and yet show ignorance and myopic view.
2. To you every Indian is Hindu, to me an Indian can be a Muslim, Sikh, Hindu, Christian, Buddhist, Atheist etc.; and the achievements shown in my article were of Indians and not of Hindus.
3. Similarly I gave some details of achievements of Jews and not Israelis or Zionists; and many of these achievements were made before Israel was established.
4. The clear purpose of these articles was to show why we Muslims are lacking behind; and if we want to compete with others then we have to change our priorities and make ourselves competitive. The time and money we spend on receptions of ‘Thanedaars’, ‘Patwarees and other politicians who come from AJK and Pakistan could be used to educate our children that they also achieve their full potential and reach in places where decisions are made.
5. Your interpretation of that is making India ‘Mahaan’; what can I say - it is people like you have given many interpretations to holy Qur’an because it suits their agenda.
6. I know assigned role of some people is to oppose me and some other people who also sincerely advance Kashmir dispute in its true perspective, and criticise us no matter what we do, as that is there bread and butter. Even if pray in front of them they will criticise me for not standing correctly, or folding me hands as they would like me to do.
7. I have time and again condemned atrocities of Indian government, but people like you expect me to mention that in every paragraph and broadcast erroneous data issued by ISI and their sub agencies and agents. With experience and knowledge I can differentiate between facts and propaganda; and like many others don’t become tool of those who want to use people of Jammu and Kashmir in a proxy war and proxy politics and to score points against each other.
8. Furthermore no one has compiled complete and impartial data of atrocities yet. Indian forces and their agencies have been one source of killings and atrocities, but there are many other sources as well, and people like you who hide their true identity want to hold India responsible for all killings; and exonerate other sources of killings.
9. This topic demands a comprehensive research to find out how many people have been killed by Indian forces, how many have been killed by cross border firing, internal group fighting which was rampage in 1990s, bombs thrown in crowded markets and at bus stops (one research showed that out of 10 bombs 9 missed targets and landed where innocent people were killed, and who do you hold responsible for that? And who do you hold responsible when these ‘mujahids’ fire on an army jeep in a town centre and people are killed in subsequent cross firing? Guerrilla war is not fought in markets and town centres). And above all how many people have been killed on instructions of Pakistani agencies and jihadi groups to silence political and ideological opponents.
10. Ignorant and simple person will buy propaganda from Pakistani agencies and from identity - shy person like you, but I have a long association with the true nationalist struggle, and have matured during the process and know who is wearing which hat and ‘plugged’ where.
11. I am a nationalist Kashmiri and all my struggle has been and still is for united and independent Jammu and Kashmir; but I am not among those who sell ‘accession to Pakistan’, ‘self rule’ and ‘out of box solution’ as a right of self determination and independence.
12. And for your information canvas of my activities is much wider than Kashnet (which only links up Kashmiris and all those who have some interest in the Kashmir dispute); and if you don’t know this then I cannot help your ignorance in this matter, and your myopic view of Kashmir dispute.
13. I am convinced that people like you can never be persuaded because of deep rooted interest and shallow understanding of Kashmir dispute, and I have not written this to persuade you. This is for those ordinary folks who sincerely want to advance Kashmir cause and have suffered for this; but could be influenced by negative propaganda.
Second Reply
Dear brother Siraj aslamo alaykam
Thank you for your comments even though it was not expected from a person of your stature to draw that kind of meaning from that article, and then use the language you have used. However it is your right to read something and attach whatever value or interpretation that suits you; and that value and interpretation doesn’t have to be correct.
No one say there is no poverty in India and I didn’t say it either. If you think I have, read it again and this time read it carefully and try to understand the message.
India has a considerable influence in the world politics and that is not because of poverty which you refer to. They have that influence because they have their people in right places; and they have invested in science and technology.
China and Russia are also big players in the world politics, and they also have a lot of poverty; and their influence is also not due to poverty.
So you think Pakistan is winning after 26/11? That is why they have Security Council resolution passed against them within minutes and Pakistan stands alone in comity of nations.
I don’t think I have ‘glorified’ India or everything what India does. And I strongly disagree with you that it ‘was a cheap attempt to make Pakistanis and Kashmiris look inferior’. My message was that if they want to be competitive then they will have to abandon certain wrong practices and invest in education.
The fact that you people from the Valley have done well in education doesn’t mean that all Kashmiris are educated and influential. And if we Kashmiris and Pakistanis (in most countries we Kashmiris are taken as Pakistanis) are more educated and more influential then tell me why we get humiliating treatment in most countries.
Also tell me why majority of our people work in low class jobs. How many of our people work in places where decisions are made. How many of us work in government departments and Think Tanks which matter.
Prisons are full of people from AJK and Pakistan in Britain; we are at the bottom of economic and social ladder. Majority of our children fail at school and don't go to college or universities, and you know what- many of them sell drugs and run brothels and massage centres.
We are behind because our lot spend more time and money on politics of AJK and Pakistan and spend money giving receptions and parties to patawaris, thanedaars and politicians from AJK and Pakistan instead of paying for tuition of their children.
In my article I talked of achievements of Indians and it is regrettable that even a person like you is talking in terms of Hindu and Muslims. If that is the approach to discuss matters by educated people then I am afraid I cannot be part of that discussion
Your last paragraph is so ludicrous that it doesn’t deserve a reply.
Can you prove the data I have used is fake?
Third Reply
Aslamo alaykam Independent Kashmir
1. Thank you for your email and your sincere efforts to twist words, deliberately draw wrong conclusions and bring in issues which I have not said.
2. I never said that massacres and rapes in Kashmir are ‘questionable’ or ‘debateable’. It is your ‘simplicity’ which is in action and showing true colours. This is what I said, and tell me where I said massacres are questionable: ‘Furthermore no one has compiled complete and impartial data of atrocities yet. Indian forces and their agencies have been one source of killings and atrocities, but there are many other sources as well, and people like you who hide their true identity want to hold India responsible for all killings; and exonerate other sources of killings’.
3. If an Indian soldier kills an innocent person or rapes someone it is very bad and must be condemned; but if your ‘mujahid’ commits the same crime, although much fewer in number, it is worse. He is there to provide protection and defend dignity and honour of the people.
4. Incident of Kunan-Poshpora was a tragedy, and we strongly condemned it, wrote articles against it, produced leaflets to expose culprits, held demonstrations and went on a hunger strike outside the Indian High Commission in London. We still condemn atrocities and rapes taking place in J&K. I don’t care if you don’t know what contribution we have made to the cause of Kashmir.
5. I don’t need your approval or compliment to do what we think is right to promote the Kashmir cause or plight of the people. I have strength of character, courage and ability to do what I think is right irrespective of what people with myopic view and misplaced loyalty think about me.
6. For your information rapes on the Pakistani side of the LOC also take place. You don’t know what people have to endure who live near the LOC, but they want to be tight lipped about their plight for two reasons: (1) it is disgrace to the family, (2) fear of more repercussions.
7. Also there is no militancy on the Pakistani side of the LOC, so there is no need for them to use rape as a weapon, as it was used on the other side. Not long ago three soldiers raped a Kashmiri girl in a forest in Athmaqaam, and it was discussed on the Kashnet for many days. Of course you won’t remember this, as myopic view can only allow you to see in one direction.
8. Furthermore personal interests and rewards sometimes do not allow people to think rationally or analyse the situation objectively, as they are given a set agenda and they have to follow that.
9. Sometimes people could be sincere in their approach and politics and yet be wrong. I admire these people, I know with time they will realise their mistake and stop advancing anti Kashmir agenda, or agenda of our occupiers. But then there are other people who know what is in the best interest of people of Jammu and Kashmir, and yet they choose to advance a non Kashmiri agenda because they get ‘mann o salwa’ or ‘maal e ghaneemat’. It is this ‘mann o salwa’ and ‘maal e ghaneemat’ which is also hindering our fight for united and independent Jammu and Kashmir.
10. You call yourself ‘simple Kashmiri student’; your simplicity is like that of ‘jalaibee’. It is because of ‘simple’ people like you that we Kashmiris find ourselves in this mess. May Allah save us Kashmiris from this kind of ‘simplicity’ which furthers interests of our occupiers and prolong misery and suffering of the people.
11. I pray Allah (SWT) to put you on the right path that you can also join those who are sincerely advancing a pro Kashmir and pro people agenda.
Wassalam
Dr Shabir Choudhry
Fourth Reply
Aslamo alaykam Qadeer Ahmad or whatever your real name is
You wrote: He admits in his recent post that he is 54. It is an admission of a failed person.
Reply:
In your opinion when some one reaches 54 he becomes a failed person. What a logic you have given? At this age a person becomes more experience and wiser. This comment shows your mental approach. Do I need to say anymore?
A frog which has lived in a well all his life thinks that is the entire universe – poor thing.
You wrote:
Shabir Choudhry has changed 4 or more political masters. He has written for and against Amnaullah, Yasin Malik, Majid Tramboo, Nazir Gilani and more. He has never written as a patriotic Kashmiri.
Reply
I never had any political master. It is people like you who have political masters, and when one retires you are handed to the next one. I had Amanullah Khan as a Chairman of JKLF and when we realised his game plan and his betrayal to the ideology of united and independent Kashmir we challenged him. That shows our strength of character and commitment to our ideology; it shows that we are not blind followers like you.
Similarly when Yasin Malik started messing up things and started treading the same path what earlier Amanullah Khan had taken, we also challenged him because our struggle was not for the Valley of Kashmir only or any kind of divisions as one Hurriyet Conference leader Prof Ghani Bhat has advocated in a TV interview recently (division of the State on religious lines).
Majid Tramboo was brought in the JKLF fold by me, I was Secretary General of the JKLF and Head of the Diplomatic Section at that time ….when I became the President of JKLF he was a central committee member, so no question of relationship of political master.
All nationalist Kashmiris know what kind of ‘nationalism’ these three advocate.
As for Dr Nazir Gilani is concerned, he was and still is a political colleague. Unlike some of you, who only know to rub salt in wounds, twist words, change facts, lie and deceit in order to please your masters and advance your agenda, he had decency to enquire about my health and expressed his well wishes.
From the background you have come from there is only one relationship, and that is of a master and a servant, and no wonder only that comes to your mind. For your information I receive more than 300 emails every day; and writers who represent trends in society and ground realities from time to time quote from emails and some times present full letters.
You wrote:
He seems to have no notion what an author means. Every tom, dick and harry writes a pamphlet. Writing a pamphlet does not make you an author.
I had my first novel published when I was only 18 years old. It was 480 pages, second novel 370 pages. First Urdu book on history and politics of Kashmir and Pakistan 350. Ten books in English on different aspects of the Kashmiri struggle ranging from 200 pages to 490 pages. Five more books in Urdu ranging from 150 pages to 270 pages. To you these are pamphlets. I need no certificate from some one like you. For a poor frog entire universe is the well
You wrote:
He has a two man party.
Reply
We formed a new party, Kashmir National Party about 8 months ago, and already we are larger than Yasin’s JKLF and Amanullah Khan JKLF in UK, in AJK and in Pakistan. Most of those who joined us are from these JKLF groups. More than 150 people joined us last month alone, and that is worrying to your bosses. If this trend is not stopped and propaganda against us is not effective then you won’t get promoted, so work hard and send more lies and distorted things to the Kashnet and other networks.
I hope one day Allah guides you and put you on right path, if not on the Day of Judgement you could be on the receiving end.
Wassalam
First Reply
1. I have looked at your email message carefully and note that you are also an educated person, and yet show ignorance and myopic view.
2. To you every Indian is Hindu, to me an Indian can be a Muslim, Sikh, Hindu, Christian, Buddhist, Atheist etc.; and the achievements shown in my article were of Indians and not of Hindus.
3. Similarly I gave some details of achievements of Jews and not Israelis or Zionists; and many of these achievements were made before Israel was established.
4. The clear purpose of these articles was to show why we Muslims are lacking behind; and if we want to compete with others then we have to change our priorities and make ourselves competitive. The time and money we spend on receptions of ‘Thanedaars’, ‘Patwarees and other politicians who come from AJK and Pakistan could be used to educate our children that they also achieve their full potential and reach in places where decisions are made.
5. Your interpretation of that is making India ‘Mahaan’; what can I say - it is people like you have given many interpretations to holy Qur’an because it suits their agenda.
6. I know assigned role of some people is to oppose me and some other people who also sincerely advance Kashmir dispute in its true perspective, and criticise us no matter what we do, as that is there bread and butter. Even if pray in front of them they will criticise me for not standing correctly, or folding me hands as they would like me to do.
7. I have time and again condemned atrocities of Indian government, but people like you expect me to mention that in every paragraph and broadcast erroneous data issued by ISI and their sub agencies and agents. With experience and knowledge I can differentiate between facts and propaganda; and like many others don’t become tool of those who want to use people of Jammu and Kashmir in a proxy war and proxy politics and to score points against each other.
8. Furthermore no one has compiled complete and impartial data of atrocities yet. Indian forces and their agencies have been one source of killings and atrocities, but there are many other sources as well, and people like you who hide their true identity want to hold India responsible for all killings; and exonerate other sources of killings.
9. This topic demands a comprehensive research to find out how many people have been killed by Indian forces, how many have been killed by cross border firing, internal group fighting which was rampage in 1990s, bombs thrown in crowded markets and at bus stops (one research showed that out of 10 bombs 9 missed targets and landed where innocent people were killed, and who do you hold responsible for that? And who do you hold responsible when these ‘mujahids’ fire on an army jeep in a town centre and people are killed in subsequent cross firing? Guerrilla war is not fought in markets and town centres). And above all how many people have been killed on instructions of Pakistani agencies and jihadi groups to silence political and ideological opponents.
10. Ignorant and simple person will buy propaganda from Pakistani agencies and from identity - shy person like you, but I have a long association with the true nationalist struggle, and have matured during the process and know who is wearing which hat and ‘plugged’ where.
11. I am a nationalist Kashmiri and all my struggle has been and still is for united and independent Jammu and Kashmir; but I am not among those who sell ‘accession to Pakistan’, ‘self rule’ and ‘out of box solution’ as a right of self determination and independence.
12. And for your information canvas of my activities is much wider than Kashnet (which only links up Kashmiris and all those who have some interest in the Kashmir dispute); and if you don’t know this then I cannot help your ignorance in this matter, and your myopic view of Kashmir dispute.
13. I am convinced that people like you can never be persuaded because of deep rooted interest and shallow understanding of Kashmir dispute, and I have not written this to persuade you. This is for those ordinary folks who sincerely want to advance Kashmir cause and have suffered for this; but could be influenced by negative propaganda.
Second Reply
Dear brother Siraj aslamo alaykam
Thank you for your comments even though it was not expected from a person of your stature to draw that kind of meaning from that article, and then use the language you have used. However it is your right to read something and attach whatever value or interpretation that suits you; and that value and interpretation doesn’t have to be correct.
No one say there is no poverty in India and I didn’t say it either. If you think I have, read it again and this time read it carefully and try to understand the message.
India has a considerable influence in the world politics and that is not because of poverty which you refer to. They have that influence because they have their people in right places; and they have invested in science and technology.
China and Russia are also big players in the world politics, and they also have a lot of poverty; and their influence is also not due to poverty.
So you think Pakistan is winning after 26/11? That is why they have Security Council resolution passed against them within minutes and Pakistan stands alone in comity of nations.
I don’t think I have ‘glorified’ India or everything what India does. And I strongly disagree with you that it ‘was a cheap attempt to make Pakistanis and Kashmiris look inferior’. My message was that if they want to be competitive then they will have to abandon certain wrong practices and invest in education.
The fact that you people from the Valley have done well in education doesn’t mean that all Kashmiris are educated and influential. And if we Kashmiris and Pakistanis (in most countries we Kashmiris are taken as Pakistanis) are more educated and more influential then tell me why we get humiliating treatment in most countries.
Also tell me why majority of our people work in low class jobs. How many of our people work in places where decisions are made. How many of us work in government departments and Think Tanks which matter.
Prisons are full of people from AJK and Pakistan in Britain; we are at the bottom of economic and social ladder. Majority of our children fail at school and don't go to college or universities, and you know what- many of them sell drugs and run brothels and massage centres.
We are behind because our lot spend more time and money on politics of AJK and Pakistan and spend money giving receptions and parties to patawaris, thanedaars and politicians from AJK and Pakistan instead of paying for tuition of their children.
In my article I talked of achievements of Indians and it is regrettable that even a person like you is talking in terms of Hindu and Muslims. If that is the approach to discuss matters by educated people then I am afraid I cannot be part of that discussion
Your last paragraph is so ludicrous that it doesn’t deserve a reply.
Can you prove the data I have used is fake?
Third Reply
Aslamo alaykam Independent Kashmir
1. Thank you for your email and your sincere efforts to twist words, deliberately draw wrong conclusions and bring in issues which I have not said.
2. I never said that massacres and rapes in Kashmir are ‘questionable’ or ‘debateable’. It is your ‘simplicity’ which is in action and showing true colours. This is what I said, and tell me where I said massacres are questionable: ‘Furthermore no one has compiled complete and impartial data of atrocities yet. Indian forces and their agencies have been one source of killings and atrocities, but there are many other sources as well, and people like you who hide their true identity want to hold India responsible for all killings; and exonerate other sources of killings’.
3. If an Indian soldier kills an innocent person or rapes someone it is very bad and must be condemned; but if your ‘mujahid’ commits the same crime, although much fewer in number, it is worse. He is there to provide protection and defend dignity and honour of the people.
4. Incident of Kunan-Poshpora was a tragedy, and we strongly condemned it, wrote articles against it, produced leaflets to expose culprits, held demonstrations and went on a hunger strike outside the Indian High Commission in London. We still condemn atrocities and rapes taking place in J&K. I don’t care if you don’t know what contribution we have made to the cause of Kashmir.
5. I don’t need your approval or compliment to do what we think is right to promote the Kashmir cause or plight of the people. I have strength of character, courage and ability to do what I think is right irrespective of what people with myopic view and misplaced loyalty think about me.
6. For your information rapes on the Pakistani side of the LOC also take place. You don’t know what people have to endure who live near the LOC, but they want to be tight lipped about their plight for two reasons: (1) it is disgrace to the family, (2) fear of more repercussions.
7. Also there is no militancy on the Pakistani side of the LOC, so there is no need for them to use rape as a weapon, as it was used on the other side. Not long ago three soldiers raped a Kashmiri girl in a forest in Athmaqaam, and it was discussed on the Kashnet for many days. Of course you won’t remember this, as myopic view can only allow you to see in one direction.
8. Furthermore personal interests and rewards sometimes do not allow people to think rationally or analyse the situation objectively, as they are given a set agenda and they have to follow that.
9. Sometimes people could be sincere in their approach and politics and yet be wrong. I admire these people, I know with time they will realise their mistake and stop advancing anti Kashmir agenda, or agenda of our occupiers. But then there are other people who know what is in the best interest of people of Jammu and Kashmir, and yet they choose to advance a non Kashmiri agenda because they get ‘mann o salwa’ or ‘maal e ghaneemat’. It is this ‘mann o salwa’ and ‘maal e ghaneemat’ which is also hindering our fight for united and independent Jammu and Kashmir.
10. You call yourself ‘simple Kashmiri student’; your simplicity is like that of ‘jalaibee’. It is because of ‘simple’ people like you that we Kashmiris find ourselves in this mess. May Allah save us Kashmiris from this kind of ‘simplicity’ which furthers interests of our occupiers and prolong misery and suffering of the people.
11. I pray Allah (SWT) to put you on the right path that you can also join those who are sincerely advancing a pro Kashmir and pro people agenda.
Wassalam
Dr Shabir Choudhry
Fourth Reply
Aslamo alaykam Qadeer Ahmad or whatever your real name is
You wrote: He admits in his recent post that he is 54. It is an admission of a failed person.
Reply:
In your opinion when some one reaches 54 he becomes a failed person. What a logic you have given? At this age a person becomes more experience and wiser. This comment shows your mental approach. Do I need to say anymore?
A frog which has lived in a well all his life thinks that is the entire universe – poor thing.
You wrote:
Shabir Choudhry has changed 4 or more political masters. He has written for and against Amnaullah, Yasin Malik, Majid Tramboo, Nazir Gilani and more. He has never written as a patriotic Kashmiri.
Reply
I never had any political master. It is people like you who have political masters, and when one retires you are handed to the next one. I had Amanullah Khan as a Chairman of JKLF and when we realised his game plan and his betrayal to the ideology of united and independent Kashmir we challenged him. That shows our strength of character and commitment to our ideology; it shows that we are not blind followers like you.
Similarly when Yasin Malik started messing up things and started treading the same path what earlier Amanullah Khan had taken, we also challenged him because our struggle was not for the Valley of Kashmir only or any kind of divisions as one Hurriyet Conference leader Prof Ghani Bhat has advocated in a TV interview recently (division of the State on religious lines).
Majid Tramboo was brought in the JKLF fold by me, I was Secretary General of the JKLF and Head of the Diplomatic Section at that time ….when I became the President of JKLF he was a central committee member, so no question of relationship of political master.
All nationalist Kashmiris know what kind of ‘nationalism’ these three advocate.
As for Dr Nazir Gilani is concerned, he was and still is a political colleague. Unlike some of you, who only know to rub salt in wounds, twist words, change facts, lie and deceit in order to please your masters and advance your agenda, he had decency to enquire about my health and expressed his well wishes.
From the background you have come from there is only one relationship, and that is of a master and a servant, and no wonder only that comes to your mind. For your information I receive more than 300 emails every day; and writers who represent trends in society and ground realities from time to time quote from emails and some times present full letters.
You wrote:
He seems to have no notion what an author means. Every tom, dick and harry writes a pamphlet. Writing a pamphlet does not make you an author.
I had my first novel published when I was only 18 years old. It was 480 pages, second novel 370 pages. First Urdu book on history and politics of Kashmir and Pakistan 350. Ten books in English on different aspects of the Kashmiri struggle ranging from 200 pages to 490 pages. Five more books in Urdu ranging from 150 pages to 270 pages. To you these are pamphlets. I need no certificate from some one like you. For a poor frog entire universe is the well
You wrote:
He has a two man party.
Reply
We formed a new party, Kashmir National Party about 8 months ago, and already we are larger than Yasin’s JKLF and Amanullah Khan JKLF in UK, in AJK and in Pakistan. Most of those who joined us are from these JKLF groups. More than 150 people joined us last month alone, and that is worrying to your bosses. If this trend is not stopped and propaganda against us is not effective then you won’t get promoted, so work hard and send more lies and distorted things to the Kashnet and other networks.
I hope one day Allah guides you and put you on right path, if not on the Day of Judgement you could be on the receiving end.
Wassalam
Saturday, 3 January 2009
Why Indians are influential
Why Indians are influential
Dr Shabir Choudhry 04 January 2009
In response to my article ‘Why Jews are powerful and Muslims are powerless’ I got a lot of response. Many appreciated it but some, once again, called me a ‘Yahoodi agent’ – agent of Jews, just because I have highlighted some of the contribution made by Jews to science and learning. Some said Jews are killing innocent Palestinians and you are praising them.
First of all I wrote that piece before the present crises started in Gaza. What Israel is doing in Palestine is condemned by people through out world and I also condemn it. But does it mean no one should talk of achievements of Jews just because Zionist government is killing innocent people? In any case a lot of contribution of Jews was made before the establishment of the Jewish State, and without its patronage.
As for blame game is concerned it is part of political culture of Pakistan and Kashmir to call those people ‘agent’ with whom there is political or ideological difference or personal goal to settle. Agencies of both India and Pakistan have been successful in creating this social and political environment where they no longer have to point fingers at anyone, as people are too eager to do it themselves. I got this ‘title’ of being ‘agent of Jews’ in 1999 when I wrote ‘Pakistan should recognise Israel’.
Since that I have been ‘awarded’ with such more ‘titles’ for my political and literary work, but I have not given - in to this harassment, intimidation and blackmailing; and continued with my jihad of speaking truth and providing knowledge which I think is based on facts, and by promoting culture of tolerance, moderation and accountability.
Why Indians are influential
Pakistan is one day older than India and is gifted with enormous natural resources and strategically very important geography. Apart from that Pakistan was the biggest Muslim country with close relationship with the Muslim world, which added to Pakistan’s potential to enhance its influence and power.
Today what we witness is (which is acknowledged by some Pakistani writers and politicians) that Pakistan stands alone in comity of nations; and majority of the countries, including Muslim countries stand with India; and take pride in having relations with India. Economically, politically, democratically, militarily and financially both countries are miles apart, emotionalism aside there is no comparison between them; both countries had to travel a long journey to reach this stage.
Victory always has more than one claimant, and no one likes to share blame in failure; and as Pakistan’s failures is too obvious in many fields I would not like to point them out as it could upset my Pakistani brothers, hence more allegations against me. Fact however remains that Pakistan cannot even provide sufficient food for its people, even though its economy is agrarian. Apart from that there is severe shortage of power, clean water and many other vital things. However there is no shortage of suicide bombers, bomb blasts, internal fighting, extremism, undemocratic decisions and American attacks. All these are recipe for disaster for any country and any society.
India’s success is mainly due to its democratic system. Despite corruption and other contradictions and problems in the society, the democracy and investment in education, science and technology has helped India to advance; and play an important role in world politics. Let us look at some achievements made by Indians.
Richest man in the world is an Indian, Mukesh Ambani who was born in April 1957. He completed his graduation in Chemical engineering, and studied for MBA at Stanford University, and joined Relinace Industries in 1981. He is a Chairman and Managing Director of Reliance Industries and resides in Mumbai. He is the richest man in the world with total value of $63.2 billion not because he is Hindu or an Indian, but because he is an entrepreneur who has worked hard for his position.
The fifth richest man is also an Indian, Lakshmi Mittal with total value of $50.9 billion. He was born on 15th of June 1950 in Rajasthan. He heads the multi national steel company Mittal Steel, which is one of the largest steel companies in the world, with steel making facilities in fourteen countries with 150,000 employees.
General Manager of Hewlett Packard is an Indian, Rajiv Gupta; creator of Pentium chip (90% of the today's computers run on it) is also an Indian, Vinod Dahm. Creator of world's No1 web based email program – hotmail is also an Indian - Sabeer Bhatia. The president of AT & T-Bell Labs - creator of programmes like C, C++, Unix etc is an India, Arun Netravalli. Microsoft Testing Director of Windows 2000 and responsible for all initial problems is an Indian, Sanjay Tejwrika.
There are 3.22 millions of Indians in USA - 1.5% of population, yet:
38% of doctors in USA are Indians;
12% scientists in USA are Indians;
36% of NASA scientists are Indians;
34% of Microsoft employees are Indians;
28% of IBM employees are Indians;
17% of INTEL scientists are Indians;
13% of XEROX employees are Indians.
Indians constitute ten percent of all medical students in America.
Indians own nearly 40% of all the small and mid-size hotels in the country.
Four out of 10 Silicon Valley startups are run by Indians.
Indians are the richest immigrant class in the US, with nearly 200,000 millionaires.
Between 1990 and 2000, the population of Indian scientists and engineers (S&E) in Silicon Valley grew by 646%.
Apart from that India consumes a fifth of the world's gold output. India is the largest producer and consumer of tea in the world, accounting for more than 30% of global production and 25% of consumption. India is the world's premier centre for diamond cutting and polishing. Nine out of every 10 stones sold in the world pass through India. India's Hero Honda is the world's largest motorcycle manufacturer, with 2002 production of 1.7m units. India has the second-largest pool of scientists and engineers in the world. India has the third-largest investor base in the world.
India has the third-largest army in the world, nearly 1.5 million strong. Indian Railways is the largest employer in the world, with a staff of 1.6 million people under single management. India is the second-largest cement-producing country in the world, producing more than 110m tonnes. India is the largest democracy in the world, with nearly 400m voting in the last national elections.
India is among the few countries who have built a supercomputer indigenously. India is ranked the sixth country in the world in terms of satellite launches. There are over 70,000 bank branches in India - among the highest in the world. Indian immigrants have founded more engineering and technology companies in the US in the past decade (1995-2005) than immigrants from the UK, China, Taiwan and Japan combined. Almost 26% of all immigrant-founded companies in the last ten years were founded by Indian immigrants. Immigrants from the UK, China, and Taiwan contributed to 7.1%, 6.9% and 5.8% of all immigrant-founded businesses, respectively.
Based on analysis of the World Intellectual Property Organization, patent databases, the largest group of immigrant non-citizen inventors were Chinese (Mainland and Taiwan-born). Indians were second, followed by the Canadians and British.
This list is not complete, as all the data cannot be included in one article. Most of the above data deals with the Indians in the USA, but Indians also live in the Arab world, Britain and other European countries where they are making substantial contribution to the economies of those countries. The main reason for that is Indians are educated, and they have made a reputation of being honest and hard working people. Many countries prefer to have labour from India rather than Pakistan or Azad Kashmir; and one doesn’t have to be a rocket scientist to know reasons for this.
There are more Indians in Britain than Pakistanis and Kashmiris put together. Whereas we have more people in prisons and in low level jobs; Indians have more people in ‘white collar’ jobs and places of power. We spend more time and money in arranging functions, welcome parties and receptions for police inspectors, ‘patwaris’ and local politicians from AJK and Pakistan than on education of our children and making political space for ourselves in Britain.
I have written this knowing that it will open a flood gate of criticism against me because in our society we are taught to dislike and hate Hindus and Jews; and I have dared to highlight contributions of both communities. I hope my message is understood in its true perspective that we need to channel our energies in making ourselves more competitive rather than cursing others for our mistakes and miseries.
Writer is a Spokesman of Kashmir National Party, political analyst and author of many books and booklets. Also he is Director Institute of Kashmir Affairs. Email: drshabirchoudhry@gmail.com
To view other articles see my blog: http://www.drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com/
Dr Shabir Choudhry 04 January 2009
In response to my article ‘Why Jews are powerful and Muslims are powerless’ I got a lot of response. Many appreciated it but some, once again, called me a ‘Yahoodi agent’ – agent of Jews, just because I have highlighted some of the contribution made by Jews to science and learning. Some said Jews are killing innocent Palestinians and you are praising them.
First of all I wrote that piece before the present crises started in Gaza. What Israel is doing in Palestine is condemned by people through out world and I also condemn it. But does it mean no one should talk of achievements of Jews just because Zionist government is killing innocent people? In any case a lot of contribution of Jews was made before the establishment of the Jewish State, and without its patronage.
As for blame game is concerned it is part of political culture of Pakistan and Kashmir to call those people ‘agent’ with whom there is political or ideological difference or personal goal to settle. Agencies of both India and Pakistan have been successful in creating this social and political environment where they no longer have to point fingers at anyone, as people are too eager to do it themselves. I got this ‘title’ of being ‘agent of Jews’ in 1999 when I wrote ‘Pakistan should recognise Israel’.
Since that I have been ‘awarded’ with such more ‘titles’ for my political and literary work, but I have not given - in to this harassment, intimidation and blackmailing; and continued with my jihad of speaking truth and providing knowledge which I think is based on facts, and by promoting culture of tolerance, moderation and accountability.
Why Indians are influential
Pakistan is one day older than India and is gifted with enormous natural resources and strategically very important geography. Apart from that Pakistan was the biggest Muslim country with close relationship with the Muslim world, which added to Pakistan’s potential to enhance its influence and power.
Today what we witness is (which is acknowledged by some Pakistani writers and politicians) that Pakistan stands alone in comity of nations; and majority of the countries, including Muslim countries stand with India; and take pride in having relations with India. Economically, politically, democratically, militarily and financially both countries are miles apart, emotionalism aside there is no comparison between them; both countries had to travel a long journey to reach this stage.
Victory always has more than one claimant, and no one likes to share blame in failure; and as Pakistan’s failures is too obvious in many fields I would not like to point them out as it could upset my Pakistani brothers, hence more allegations against me. Fact however remains that Pakistan cannot even provide sufficient food for its people, even though its economy is agrarian. Apart from that there is severe shortage of power, clean water and many other vital things. However there is no shortage of suicide bombers, bomb blasts, internal fighting, extremism, undemocratic decisions and American attacks. All these are recipe for disaster for any country and any society.
India’s success is mainly due to its democratic system. Despite corruption and other contradictions and problems in the society, the democracy and investment in education, science and technology has helped India to advance; and play an important role in world politics. Let us look at some achievements made by Indians.
Richest man in the world is an Indian, Mukesh Ambani who was born in April 1957. He completed his graduation in Chemical engineering, and studied for MBA at Stanford University, and joined Relinace Industries in 1981. He is a Chairman and Managing Director of Reliance Industries and resides in Mumbai. He is the richest man in the world with total value of $63.2 billion not because he is Hindu or an Indian, but because he is an entrepreneur who has worked hard for his position.
The fifth richest man is also an Indian, Lakshmi Mittal with total value of $50.9 billion. He was born on 15th of June 1950 in Rajasthan. He heads the multi national steel company Mittal Steel, which is one of the largest steel companies in the world, with steel making facilities in fourteen countries with 150,000 employees.
General Manager of Hewlett Packard is an Indian, Rajiv Gupta; creator of Pentium chip (90% of the today's computers run on it) is also an Indian, Vinod Dahm. Creator of world's No1 web based email program – hotmail is also an Indian - Sabeer Bhatia. The president of AT & T-Bell Labs - creator of programmes like C, C++, Unix etc is an India, Arun Netravalli. Microsoft Testing Director of Windows 2000 and responsible for all initial problems is an Indian, Sanjay Tejwrika.
There are 3.22 millions of Indians in USA - 1.5% of population, yet:
38% of doctors in USA are Indians;
12% scientists in USA are Indians;
36% of NASA scientists are Indians;
34% of Microsoft employees are Indians;
28% of IBM employees are Indians;
17% of INTEL scientists are Indians;
13% of XEROX employees are Indians.
Indians constitute ten percent of all medical students in America.
Indians own nearly 40% of all the small and mid-size hotels in the country.
Four out of 10 Silicon Valley startups are run by Indians.
Indians are the richest immigrant class in the US, with nearly 200,000 millionaires.
Between 1990 and 2000, the population of Indian scientists and engineers (S&E) in Silicon Valley grew by 646%.
Apart from that India consumes a fifth of the world's gold output. India is the largest producer and consumer of tea in the world, accounting for more than 30% of global production and 25% of consumption. India is the world's premier centre for diamond cutting and polishing. Nine out of every 10 stones sold in the world pass through India. India's Hero Honda is the world's largest motorcycle manufacturer, with 2002 production of 1.7m units. India has the second-largest pool of scientists and engineers in the world. India has the third-largest investor base in the world.
India has the third-largest army in the world, nearly 1.5 million strong. Indian Railways is the largest employer in the world, with a staff of 1.6 million people under single management. India is the second-largest cement-producing country in the world, producing more than 110m tonnes. India is the largest democracy in the world, with nearly 400m voting in the last national elections.
India is among the few countries who have built a supercomputer indigenously. India is ranked the sixth country in the world in terms of satellite launches. There are over 70,000 bank branches in India - among the highest in the world. Indian immigrants have founded more engineering and technology companies in the US in the past decade (1995-2005) than immigrants from the UK, China, Taiwan and Japan combined. Almost 26% of all immigrant-founded companies in the last ten years were founded by Indian immigrants. Immigrants from the UK, China, and Taiwan contributed to 7.1%, 6.9% and 5.8% of all immigrant-founded businesses, respectively.
Based on analysis of the World Intellectual Property Organization, patent databases, the largest group of immigrant non-citizen inventors were Chinese (Mainland and Taiwan-born). Indians were second, followed by the Canadians and British.
This list is not complete, as all the data cannot be included in one article. Most of the above data deals with the Indians in the USA, but Indians also live in the Arab world, Britain and other European countries where they are making substantial contribution to the economies of those countries. The main reason for that is Indians are educated, and they have made a reputation of being honest and hard working people. Many countries prefer to have labour from India rather than Pakistan or Azad Kashmir; and one doesn’t have to be a rocket scientist to know reasons for this.
There are more Indians in Britain than Pakistanis and Kashmiris put together. Whereas we have more people in prisons and in low level jobs; Indians have more people in ‘white collar’ jobs and places of power. We spend more time and money in arranging functions, welcome parties and receptions for police inspectors, ‘patwaris’ and local politicians from AJK and Pakistan than on education of our children and making political space for ourselves in Britain.
I have written this knowing that it will open a flood gate of criticism against me because in our society we are taught to dislike and hate Hindus and Jews; and I have dared to highlight contributions of both communities. I hope my message is understood in its true perspective that we need to channel our energies in making ourselves more competitive rather than cursing others for our mistakes and miseries.
Writer is a Spokesman of Kashmir National Party, political analyst and author of many books and booklets. Also he is Director Institute of Kashmir Affairs. Email: drshabirchoudhry@gmail.com
To view other articles see my blog: http://www.drshabirchoudhry.blogspot.com/